Rangers and Armed Forces Day – Whataboutery and Bad Judgement

I think it is fair to say that there will not be a repetition, at least in the same format, of the “Armed Forces Day” held at the Rangers game on Saturday. What is alleged to have happened at Ibrox on Saturday has resurrected concerns about “succulent lamb” press coverage; has brought back into fashion “whataboutery”; and has shown that in both the Army/Mod and Rangers nobody learned the lessons from last year and opened themselves up to criticism by ignoring them.

You would have thought that, after last year’s Remembrance Event there would have been some consideration given by Rangers and the Ministry of Defence to the format for Saturday’s festivities.

In case you have forgotten last November’s event resulted in the following, as reported by the Daily Record:-

Fans watched Royal Marines abseil from the stadium roof and a howitzer was fired from the trackside to signal a minute’s silence.

But following complaints, Major General Nick Eeles, General Officer Commanding Scotland, met Navy and RAF chiefs and they agreed to ban a repeat.

Instead, he has said just a minute’s silence would be a more appropriate way to mark the contribution of those who served in the two world wars and other conflicts.

In a letter to one person who complained, the Army secretariat wrote: “The General Officer Commanding Scotland has now had the opportunity to review the events that took place at Ibrox Park with the other service heads in Scotland.

“They share your view that the format of the half-time event and the conduct of those taking part in it was inappropriate for Remembrance weekend and will take steps to ensure that such events are conducted with appropriate solemnity in the future.

“They believe that the minute’s silence before the match was the correct way to mark the occasion and Army commanders will be directed to restrict future Remembrance events to this type of activity in the future.

“The focus of Remembrance activities must be on the fallen, not on those who are serving in the Armed Forces today.”

Saturday was not of course Remembrance Day, and the appearance of the military personnel was not part of Remembrance activities. But the fallout from the weekend’s celebration has been visible much faster than last year.

As the Scotsman website reports today:-

The Army confirmed today that it was aware of a number of complaints, and had launched a probe into the issue.

In a statement, it said: “We are aware of a number of complaints of against members of the Armed Forces at the Armed Forces Day match at Ibrox stadium at the weekend.

“The Army and Police Scotland, assisted by Rangers football club, are investigating these complaints. Sectarianism is a breach of the Army’s strict values and standards. If any personnel are found to have fallen short of these values and standards they will be dealt with by administrative or disciplinary action by the chain of command and, if necessary, by the police.”

Chief Superintendent Andy Bates of Police Scotland also confirmed the force had been made aware of the allegations, and was investigating.

He said: “We are aware of concerns raised regarding the conduct of a number of people attending the Rangers v Stenhousemuir game at Ibrox on Saturday. These concerns are being investigated.”

Rangers said it too was aware of complaints made about the half-time event, but could not comment further on the allegations given the police investigation.

However, the club pointed out that the day was designed to “honour” members of the Armed Forces.

In a statement, it said: “Rangers Football Club and the Rangers Charity Foundation were proud to welcome over 400 personnel from the Armed Forces to Ibrox stadium on Saturday.

“The club has always been fully committed to honouring those who sacrifice so much for their country and we were delighted to invite members of the Royal Navy, Royal Marines, Army and Royal Air Force to the match. The event was organised in conjunction with senior personnel from each branch of the Armed Forces who were also represented in the Directors Box.

“The club are aware of complaints regarding the conduct of Armed Forces personnel on the pitch at half time and understand that Police Scotland are investigating the circumstances therefore it would be inappropriate to comment further at this stage.”

Just to get that clear, there is an investigation by Police Scotland and by the Army into the behaviour of service personnel, all assisted by Rangers.

I have not looked at or listened to the video footage of the event and I cannot comment on which particular version of the Rangers songbook was being used. I have seen some of the pictures, including one which appears to show some squaddies holding up a scarf bearing the legend “Keep Ulster Protestant”. But that is not why I am writing about it.

Instead there are some separate strands which are worthy of comment.

First of all, as a result of “social media” publicity, the matter was aired in the mainstream today. The game was on Saturday but, until Roy Greenslade, in his Guardian blog yesterday, reported on the absence of any media coverage, there was no mainstream media coverage!

Now, after Professor Greenslade’s piece, and a blog by Alex Thomson of Channel 4 News, the Scottish media have reported the story. However the reports are not so much on the event itself but rather that Police Scotland and the Army are investigating.

Already there have been comments that this is an example of the return of the “succulent lamb” style of press coverage of Rangers in Scotland. I rather suspect that, instead of it being some deliberate decision to ignore it, it is part of an ingrained mind-set. People who go to football matches (and I will not single out Rangers games alone for this) are used to hearing songs and chants which would be seen as disgraceful if shouted in your local Main Street. Spectators are also used to hearing fans shouting the vilest abuse at players, managers, referees and linesmen assistant referees. People, in my experience, screen it out. It is so common that it is ignored.

In recent years, especially where Celtic and Rangers are involved, keen-eared listeners have gone out of their way to catch the words to some of the more unsavoury “traditional” tunes sung at matches. Part of this of course is carrying out the Scottish Government’s plans to eliminate sectarianism, especially at football.

Far more however, I suspect, it is to use as examples of “whataboutery”. After all, the argument goes, why can’t one group sing about being up to one’s knees in blood if the other lot sing about terrorists?

But you do not escape a speeding charge by pointing out that ten other cars have just gone past going faster than you were!

The reactions on Rangers message boards and fan websites since the issue of Saturday was raised has been almost universally one of attacking those who have had the temerity to raise the issue, and to point out, amongst the usual grossly offensive names used by some Rangers fans for the ground where Celtic play, that “rebel” songs and songs in support of terrorists are sung there. Whether they are or not is not, in my opinion, the point.

But “whataboutery” and deflection are par for the course in Scottish football.

It seems only to be when an “outsider” raises these issues (as when ESPN apologised for the singing at a Rangers v Berwick match) that the Scottish media take note – as I said, not as a deliberate policy but because it does not seem to be a story!

In the same way that “Dog Bites Man” is not news, the singing of unpleasant and offensive songs at Ibrox is not news either. Maybe it should be. But it is not.

It seems to take the intervention of an outsider to make people realise that what is alleged to have happened is NOT what should take place.

And the reaction of the internet Rangers fans fits entirely into that mind-set – it must be the “useful idiots” who are making the fuss at the prompting of “Rangers haters” who are to blame. Fighting a charge by ignoring it and simply vilifying the accuser is not generally a good way to mount a defence!

The second thread is well-explained by Logic’s Rock whose blog post here deserves to be read in full. The title, “What on Earth Was the Brass Thinking?” sums things up well. As the blogger writes:-

“Quite apart from the bad PR in Scotland, this PR disaster for the Armed Forces is even worse in Northern Ireland.  Let’s hope this is the last time we see British or Scottish troops participate in anything like this.”

Some, indeed many, of the service personnel present are likely to have been Rangers fans. Maybe lots of them are season ticket holders at Ibrox and as such would have been at the game in any event, singing their songs to their hearts’ content.

However they would not have been in uniform to do so. The fact that this was an event which must have been sanctioned by the Army/MoD must cast doubt on the thought processes which were followed.

Last year the Remembrance event at Ibrox was seen to be “inappropriate”. What consideration was given to the “appropriateness” of Saturday’s events? It was of a different nature but again was placing 400 military personnel in the spotlight.

In addition, and as was clear after last year, there were more eyes on the event than simply the Rangers supporters. The vocal Rangers fans whose views I have read are united in their opinion that this whole affair was created by the “obsessed” listening for the slightest thing by which to be offended.

Well, if that is suspected to be the situation, why give them a chance to cause trouble?

To return to the car analogy, if you have been pulled up for speeding on the same road by the same police officer, even when travelling within the speed limit, and you know that the Constable will be parked there again, perhaps you would either avoid the area, or drive past well below the speed limit.

In the same way, one would have thought that the Army might have insisted either that the matter be more low-key or, as Logic’s Rock says, more military!

Can Rangers be faulted? One might say that they have opened themselves up for criticism by allowing the event to unfold as it did. There would not appear to have been any risk assessment from the PR point of view, which seems a common theme at Ibrox in recent times.

The fault, if fault there be, lies with the service personnel who have mis-behaved whilst in uniform and the Army/Police investigation will identify wrongdoers, if any.

But the Army and Rangers have set the stage for the mis-behaviour to take place.

In football terms, it is a huge own goal.

Thirdly I have seen some of the motivation for the complaints being attributed by the Rangers fans to the hatred of the British Army by Celtic fans. I am sure that some Celtic fans do hate the British Army. I suspect that very many do not. I also think that it is highly unlikely that this issue has arisen as a device to “get at” the armed forces.

The Army did not order the participants to sing offensive songs. The fault lies with the individuals in question. But the Army and Rangers have been foolish enough to allow an opportunity for people to mis-behave and for people who might have no great love for either institution to notice this.

Finally the whole issue might be seen as a distraction from the fans who protested against the Rangers Board on Saturday and from the imminent arrival of the accounts, which were due to be published in mid-September. Cynics might have thought that this could be a cunning plan to unite the fans behind the club against the “haters”. I suspect that the moderate and restrained statement from Rangers quoted in the Scotsman piece above will not do so. Instead the fans on the web seemed to want Rangers to go “on the attack”. But, in the light of a Police Scotland and Army investigation, how could they possibly do so?

And it would be crediting Rangers with a Machiavellian level of intrigue to imagine that the whole mess was engineered as a distraction …

Wouldn’t it?

Posted by Paul McConville


Filed under Press, Rangers

149 responses to “Rangers and Armed Forces Day – Whataboutery and Bad Judgement

  1. DriverJohn

    The never ending stream of infantile behaviour emanating from this football club has made me hypothesise there is a wilful campaign by the board and it’s backers, to ‘humiliate and blacken’ the ‘would be’ good name of the club, in order to ‘force’ a bid from those who claim to be the rightful custodians of Rangers in order to avoid further embarrassment.

    • Gortnamona

      ” to ‘humiliate and blacken’ the ‘would be’ good name of the club,”

      You mean the good name of this club?

      How long will you permit that these one brain celled walking animals be the worldwide image of the country & of your long valiant history & culture?

      Or this one?

      this army of walking shit roaming aimlessly drunk around Barcelona.

      • Hi gort, was wondering how this latest masterclass in “dignified” celebration of all that is to be admired & aspired to in “Peepel Culture” was regarded in your own part of the world?

        • cam

          Nobody gives a toss!

        • Gortnamona

          Well Mac

          From a pig you expect a grunt

          And from sectarian scumbags like Rangers fans you expect gutter behaviour, in or out of uniform.

          • cam

            Dangerously insane!

          • david

            @Gutless Gormless Gortnamona
            What kind of scumbag would suggest his that someones wife and daughter would entertain a mental case?
            Gutter behaviour?

            YES, YOU, BIGOT JERKOFF.
            From the safety of a keyboard.

            Come on out, its 2013, even in conservative Ireland.

            • cam

              David,i would gladly hold your jacket for the 30 seconds it would take.
              This lunatic is losing the plot and i sinerely hope he has no family as i fear for them.

            • david
              October 1, 2013 at 10:12 am

              YES, YOU, BIGOT JERKOFF.
              From the safety of a keyboard.

              When sure you’re right…debate.

              When sure you’re wrong…threaten.

              It’s the Rangers way…

              Thick fckn windbag.

            • david

              @Carntyne Riddrie
              How many posts do I have to put up ridiculing Rangers before the penny drops that I am not a Rangers Fan????????????????????????
              If you think its ok to make vile suggestions like Gortnamona, then more fool you.

            • Gortnamona

              Davey Boy

              ” What kind of scumbag would suggest his that someones wife and daughter would entertain a mental case?”

              I strongly contest your assertion that Phil MC is a mental case and as to whether they would be willing to entertain ‘non mental cases’ I can survive without that information.

              Just a thought –

              Contradict me if I’m wrong, (you are after all the Great Wikipedia Expert) but wasn’t the Mad Monk old Gregori Rasputin very, very popular with the wives and daughters of the Russian Aristocracy?

          • Gortnamona

            Lest we Forget. – Davey Bhoy & Camshit

            this army of walking shit roaming aimlessly drunk around Barcelona.

            Your British Army adherents seem to be well up to Rangers’ normal standards.

            • david

              @Gortnamona the Galoot
              I dont think anyone will be taking any lessons in standards from you after your recent vile suggestions which I would love to ram right up your jacksie, you tosser

    • Fra

      What an embarrassing shambles of a club. The difference from before is that the world has watched and didn’t like what they saw. The religious situation both here and in Ireland has moved on. People are talking and shaking hands and ‘our boys’ are calling many of the shots which was inevitable. They were the peoples army and never has an imperialist foreign force defeated the peoples army in the long haul. Your kind (WW) may not like it but it’s here to stay, so join in or get left behind. Everybody welcome but leave the flegs at the door. LOL LOL LOL.

      • Fra
        October 1, 2013 at 8:47 am

        What an embarrassing shambles of a club. The difference from before is that the world has watched and didn’t like what they saw.

        But their followers aren’t in the least embarrassed, or if they are they keep it well hidden.

        Witness the pathetic attempts on here to defend but mainly to deflect from the antics at Ibrox on Saturday.

        The funny thing is, just as the previous club came to extinction by their own hands, Sevco fans are the authors of Saturday’s vulgar exhibition.

        What were those tits thinking when they posted such videos on youtube?

        Not thinking, probably…

  2. josephmcgrath112001809

    My dear departed mother used to tell me that keeping bad company would get me into trouble. How true.


  4. Monti

    Nothing less than a full public apology should be accepted.
    This General Eeles should publicly apologize to the Catholic community in Scotland for these utterly distasteful scenes.
    With all their problems financial & moral, you would think they should be concentrating on matters such as survival!
    The images of Armed forces personnel,jumping around to sectarian anti-Catholic songs, is frankly incitement & a very damaging choice of action.
    Personally I would like the Catholic church in Scotland to express our absolute outrage!

    • Mont…it what’s this your bottle crashed when you found out as of next year the leaches will have to work for their giros ??????????

      • Maybe ra sellick should do next years armed forces day just to show us how it’s done ? Tumbleweed …………….

        • Steven Brennan

          Dear Mr Carson, is that your real name?.
          Why would Celtic do next years or any other years armed forces day?
          What has it to do with football?
          How many other scottish teams pander to this nonsense?
          The smell from the corpse is overwhelming, try a wee pint of formaldahyde.

        • @Carson.
          Can you honestly, honestly, not see what a using you are getting? …………….

        • Ian4300


          When a NEW European Force, formed to Serve & Protect ALL their Citizens is in force, then we as a Reputable Club with a History in Europe might just do that.

        • “Celtic Football Club” Do not need gimps, sorry gimmics to tranch up support at the field of dreams you nincompoop, we stand tall, never walk alone and always play football ‘the glasgow celtic way’. That’s kinda win/lose or draw.

      • Monti

        God bless you Carson, he is with you tonight 🙂

      • R. MacGeddon

        Getting a tad confused here Carson. On other bigot sites of the blue persuasion the Catholic community in Scotland has somehow infiltrated its way into positions of power in the m(h)edia, politics, sport, education, the legal system, etc. etc. in a grand plan to undermine and destroy the hitherto privileged position of Scottish ‘protestants’. And yet here you have that same community consigned to the nether depths of society as benefit scroungers. Which is it to be?

        • @RMac, are you saying were educated, educated our children? Now about that rise in annual salary Timmy………………..

        • Geddy Lee

          Not only that. Apparently the Labour Party has been taken over by “Taigs” too. That’s why Celtic got the Commonwealth Games opening ceremony,(The word “British” has been dropped), and the Eastend got a face lift. Ergo all the Catholics in Scotland vote Labour and are unionists LOL.

          Same for the poor SNP, Catholic controlled apparently even though they are led by a Protestant Jambo.

          This shows the sheer ignorance of the mindset, and how easily they are led.

          Pop over to Munter Media on any given day. It’s infested with Unionist activists raging at the “Taig” loving SNP. You can imagine the toe-curling reaction.

          Ps did anyone see the wee Labour Councillor announcing he is going to invest half his lotto winnings in Fc Sevcovia’s holding company? He’s under the impression he’s investing in the club.LOL

          I bet the wife and family are delighted. I think it’s a cool Million.

          Apparently Swally is now raging that he was tricked into taking a “paycut”, what with all this money now pouring in. LOL

          It should earn the “Cooncillor” a coveted Blue Blazer. Surely

      • Kerrygirl

        I smell banjo

        • Kerrygirl

          As Alex Thomson said they have taken sides , that includes every investigation ,clearly the establishment have stood by ,and watched this ,been part of this, have stood by , it is now becoming so low brow, they are playing to the lowest denominator , what an embarrassment , any team can be humiliated on the park , but this club is being humiliated by stewardship

          • “humiliated by stewardship”…… KerryG, it’s a reciprocal humiliation thing, by followers & custodians, I think what we are seeing here is a something completely novel in human behaviour. Anthropologists & Sociologists worldwide will be dancing with joy over this unending bampottery

        • joe

          Carson loves the smell of Banjo in the morning

  5. Steven Brennan

    Why would the armed forces allow their personnel to be subject to the scrutiny?
    Did they learn nothing from last year?
    I am sure many people were watching that spectacle waiting for an excuse to complain, and by goodness they were given one.
    What happened at Ibrokes on Saturday happens every time they play, same songs,same shit, same people. Only difference civil servants in uniform in full view being paid by taxpayers singing sectarian songs.
    Where were the focus officers, what are they going to do about it?
    Answer: nothing
    The Scottish press are a joke.

  6. Raymilland

    A social message on civic complacency

    A backwater hick town trapped in its own history

  7. Steven Brennan

    On a different note
    You called me a gutless twat on the previous post, I replied but as Our host has moved on I will reply again
    I am on here under my own name, I have mentioned that I live in Mollinsburn, ( approx 50 dwellings) so its not hard to find me.
    You on the other hand constantly lie about where you live, East Kilbride, Methil, central Scotland , middle of nowhere etc. you also change your name to hide who you are, you sir are a lying Gutless arsehole.
    I can look back at any post and find your constant deflection and vitriol which you are now claiming was just a wee wind up of Monti.
    Let me tell you Monti has you in his pocket as his ugly bitch.
    FRO Gutless Twat indeed

  8. Dhougal

    Embarassing bigoted shambles ……..that’s plenty !!!

      • Mont…it you could help thick mick clean wheelie bins for your giro ? Just sayin.

        • Monti

          What evidence do you possess that I am unemployed?
          You can’t use the words ‘ you are on here a lot’
          I am very much employed, have been for many years.
          If your still in doubt, ask David 🙂
          Evening now.

            • Ok I’ll be “nice” ….I’d like to wish ra sellick aw ra best fur ra morra nite ………

            • We have many sellick fans on here criticising the Rangers wonderful support of our armed forces so there’s only one remedy ….your mob take their turn next year ? Up for it ? I’m sure there are many sellick fans in the “Brits ” so show them some gratitude …. Then our nation will see real embarrassing scenes .

            • R. MacGeddon

              Probably because they are…eh….armed forces….not a political football to be kicked around for sectarian purposes and stirring up hatred in a conflict not so far away that has claimed many lives and set a community back for decades. It’s only in recent times that wearing the uniform in public has been reintroduced, if there were to be many more antics like Saturday’s pathetic debacle it’ll likely be back to civvies. What have the citizens of Glasgow done to deserve this? Years of promotion by the faithers as a decent place to live and work and what we have is this kind of garbage all over the news. Dire.

            • Geddy Lee

              Tell you what Carson, as your new club is so public spirited, why don’t you guys celebrate the Emergency Services next year?

              What on earth is the obsession with the Military? No other club in WORLD football has such a relationship with Armed Forces.

              Certainly, your history would suggest you have no love for the Forces at all, but I will be keeping that for an attempted Guest Post in the run up to Remembrance Sunday.This is when “Ra Peeple” are at their sanctimonius peak.

              Ps my post will not be about the alleged War Dodgers at Ibrox., but about Remembrance Sunday, and the Protestant objections that nearly scuppered the whole project. Stay tuned.

            • Mattabhoy

              I,m a ex soldier of the first battalion the Royal HIghland Fusiliers the same white hackled soldiers you seen a t that sh.. Hole called Ibrox. To answer your question obsession with the military? Simple answer, they do it to wind us up, they know the media will say Rangers are great because they look after the troops aw the nice … Not like Celtic those evil anti British types… Not all soldiers are biggots ….

            • Steven Brennan

              Woof woof
              Goodnight everyone.
              Some of us have to work in morning, then Mighty Barca at night.win lose or draw we are in it for we deserve it.

          • david

            Yes, I can confirm that you are unemployed.
            NOBODY could spend the time you do on this blog and actually perform any tasks, and added to your proven constant lying and bigotry it is impossible to believe otherwise.

  9. Monti

    Scotland is such a beautiful country in many, many ways.
    It is a great disappointment to me that we share this country with people synonymous with a dead club & outdated & unwanted Orange attachment!
    Rid Scotland of both & watch our country grow.
    Make no mistake, Rangers were,newco are & the Orange in Scotland are THE CANCER OF CANCERS!

  10. Monti

    Just checked my back pocket, not yet steerpike, I’ll let you know when you can come out.
    Stupid,stupid man.

  11. The sectarian and racist hatred publicly displayed at ibrokes is exactly the same as that which mowed down these innocent People: http://www.ballymurphymassacre.com/cms/

    This resulted in 30 years of war.

    Scottish soldiers were the perpetrators then and that mindset is being primed to fill the coffers of a morally and fiscally corrupt business stratagem.

    No home of their own indeed.

  12. Monti

    Why not try and be nice Carson?
    Hearts & minds Carson, Hearts & minds!
    Take people with you, it makes life easier.
    Give it a go.
    The fruits to be gathered there are immeasurable Carson.

  13. MJJT

    They just can’t help themselves it’s the way of their fathers.

    Anyway not long now to someone switch their lights off!

    Tic Toc Tic Toc

  14. Ed Paisley

    I’ve heard whispers that Sevco are going to hold a half time tribute to the US Forces fighting the war on terror. They have already invited General Cheeseburger to address the crowd at half time to tell what he thinks of those goddam pinko liberals who oppose stern action against the rag-heads in Afghaniraq:-

  15. Monti

    One sleep to go before Barcelona!
    Win,lose or draw we are with you Celtic!
    Hail Hail!

  16. @Paul McConville, Paul it is a credit to you that you have dedicated a blog on this issue. There are a couple of points raised by yourself that are leaving me a little puzzled. Firstly you admit that you have not witnessed the footage. I suggest that if you had it would give you a clearer insight into why people are so outraged & horrified by….. The Event….. & that it is not simply another drive onto the whataboutry roundabout by the usual suspects. Also you draw a distinction between “succulent lambism” & “ingrained behaviour”. The term “succulent lamb” is a recent addition to the lexicon of Scottish Football, but the “ingrained behaviour” that it now symbolizes has been with it us for many many years. I would suggest that this ingrained behaviour, slinging a deaf ear to gratuitous sectarian offence, & succulent lambism, is one & the same.

  17. timtim

    How would the people of the UK react to 400 troops attending aBNP rally
    with flags saying keep Britain white?
    I would imagine outrage would be the order of the day, but lets get to the heart of this sickness the Royal family and their own bigot riddled law of accesion. Only 2 institutions have dared to discriminate openly on Catholicism and one of them still does.When its rotten at the very top and that is never challenged then you can be sure that it will infect some of the other apples in the barrel
    Or should that be oranges

  18. Ed Paisley

    I see Sevco are playing Ayr United in their next game.
    I’m sure the Honest Men will look forward to playing the Crooked Turds.

  19. wont be long now until the rubbish which are newco will once again go down the swannie FOR GOOD to be heard of never again and football will have been rid of its cancer. I was ten years in the forces and was taken aback at the way they behaved on Sat at “grayskull”.we always knew what and who run the services but how are they going to get away with this. Oh ofcourse it will be the old “high spirit” thing again

  20. Ed Paisley

    Have a look at the gallery photos of the military party on Saturday at Ibrox. One of the photos captures a group of soldiers seated in the stand with a young black soldier slap bang in the centre of the frame. That’ll have Cam burtstin’ wi pride at the inclusive new ethos at Ibrox – if you are a soldier or convicted criminal you’re in. No offence intended, Major General Easdale.

  21. cam

    Amazing what a bunch of hypocritical zealots can get up to whilst waiting to be offended.
    A marvellous day out,8 lovely goals,a nice wee singalong and our glorious troops made to feel welcome amongst their ain folk.
    They won’t need to travel far to face their next foe.
    Unfortunately the enemy within don’t fancy square go’s.

    Next up Barca,a damned fine humping and more whinging from the fundamenatists.

  22. Deansy

    The rangers ‘respect’ for our armed-forces is just lip-service – if they had any real respect for the troops they would’ve ensured Saturday was not allowed to develop into the ‘Sect-Fest’ it was. Selfishly the rangers have thrown the troops to the wolves just to appease the less-intelligent of their support – I.e the large majority. For our modern, intelligent armed-forces to be seen allied to a backward, 17th-Century sect is a huge own-goal publicity-wise and will undermine the British public’s confidence in the decision-making skills/integrity of it’s senior-officers !!

    • cam

      The PR machine in full swing,unfortunately the truth is out there.
      Dublin it ain’t and never will be!


      • very Sad cam…………
        Fine city Dublin, cosmopolitan, Protestant Catherdral, Jewish Temples, many faiths (& none) represented in it’s modern progressive outlook. The Irish National anthem not making claims on anyone else’s land or possessions. Why am I not surprised you repeatedly make bizarre, inappropriate references to Ireland’s capitol. “Fear of an Egalitarian Planet”…….. ????

  23. Raymilland

    Humane society?

    Here we go
    Round and round the floor
    Together in time
    Here we sit
    It looks like this is it
    This time

    It’s making no sense
    But we’ll stay here till the end
    This time

    They shoot horses don’t they?
    They shoot horses don’t they?
    They shoot horses don’t they?

    A crazy wishing well
    Whenever you fall
    It seems so long
    Just like a marathon
    The belle of the ball

    It’s making no sense
    But we’ll stay here till the end
    This time

    They shoot horses don’t they?
    They shoot horses don’t they?
    They shoot horses don’t they?

    • cam

      No they blow them up and call it a legitimate act of terror.Well if you’re a cowardly piece of vermin that is.

    • 1 Para,murdering unarmed PEOPLE or a horse ,take your pick.

      So much sympathy for a horse, none for unarmed people.

      • cam

        If only those snipers could have faced their enemy away from civilians eh?

        Just like their internet heroes,sniping from concealment.

        • Their enemy were the civilians, that’s who they were order to shoot and kill, like true professionals, they killed unarmed civilians,

          Killing for a wage,just following orders, no questions asked.

          My sympathy will always rest with people murdered in their homeland by foreign invaders.
          WW II Germans invaded many countries, some people carried on the fight, resistance fighters,they were called, no one in Britain labelled them terrorists. they wanted to fight those that invaded by force of arms.

          Tell me any of you Sevconians, if Scotland was invaded in the future, just for talk sake,lets say the poles.60m of them decided to invade Scotland, install their religion and language, against your wishes,
          would you become resistance/freedom fighters or would you just settle into polish rule ?
          If you decided to fight to free Scotland would you be a terrorist or a freedom fighter, would you do what ever it takes to free us all from bondage, could your lot be counted on to fight back or would you lot just doff your caps to your new rulers as you have done all throughout your history.

  24. cam

    Can’t wait for next years event.
    Bigger and better,get the Queen along,bunting along the streets,congo along to George Sq. Marvellous.

  25. willy wonka

    Paul, maybe you should do yourself a favour and actually listen and watch the coverage from Ibrox.
    There were NO sectarian songs sung.
    Police and Forces are investigating complaints ? Where did the complaints come from ? Fancy a guess ?
    Did you see who was backing up the terrorist-supporting scumbag Greenslade ? Have a look and compare his ‘statement’ with that of ten-names. They were exactly the same.
    Greenslade, Gillivan , Galloway and Haggerty all taking offence ? You couldn’t make it up.
    One last question – why is anti IRA chanting “sectarian” whilst pro IRA chanting is “political” ?
    You know what ? Don’t bother.

    • cam

      Friends who have had rabies shots inform me that he also penned a wee blog about Ally’s wages,,,,look for the patterns,follow the twitter trail.
      Concerted and organised,but still pathetic.


      Three reasonable questions – 1) Why should the armed whom we all pay for (well except Rangers FC in Liquidation) be used a propaganda tool by a football club? 2) What was your feeling when some of their number were jumping around and singing along to – The Sash – No Surrender?… 3) What is your opinion of three ‘soldiers’ posing with a Sevco scarf on which was printed Keep Ulster “Protestant”

  26. cam

    All the usual suspects playing their wee sneaky organised concerted game of PR.
    Loving every moment of it,get it out in the open,lets see what the usual suspects stand for.
    Wonder if wee Kearney might pop his head out of the bunker?
    Nah,he’ll leave it a wee bit longer till the real naughty stuff dies down.

    • @gortchomhor

      Cam, just two days ago you had never seemed happier. You and steer and coops were on here doing shifts 24 hours a day, celebrating your waspish superiority. What’s happened? Has the penny dropped? You realise the game’s up? If you disagree and think everything is still splendid, there’s a couple of things you might explain;

      1) it sounds like a majority of Sevco fans want to sack the board, how does that work if everything is splendid?

      2) Sevco fans are now wondering where the hell the accounts are and if opinions on rm are anything to go by they don’t expect good news. Why then do you?

      3) sale and lease back is now looking more likely than ever… Yet you have dismissed all suggestions that RIFC are struggling financially, please explain… While you are at it, can you explain why McCoist is now taking a wage cut?

      4) I don’t think the shower playing at Ibrox have ever been so up to their knees in controversy and disrepute, so it’s not just the finances that are looking grim. We have a pile of issues, divisions in the board, in the papers for all the wrong reasons, the old chestnut of sectarianism amongst the fans, etc. Not very good from a PR standpoint, is it?

      All in all, it’s hard to imagine how things could look worse. Its even starting to look like CW is still involved with Sevco. It’s actually embarrassing to watch, fun though. And to top it all the mighty Celtic are playing in the champions league tomorrow, carrying Scotland’s hopes and dreams. We can be sure their fans will not embarrass us or wreck anything.

  27. dan

    A certain person is getting hysterical on here. Marvellous! Even talking about ‘square go’s and stuff’!!!!!!!! Still, I suppose you can safely talk the talk—anonymously.

    Bet he’s never had a square go in his life—–or maybe I should take that back. Maybe he has had at least one square go, got whupped and slid behind his keyboard thereafter. What a poor excuse for a human being he is. Imagine having sired something like that? What a waste of bum thrusting!

    But hey, can’t you just feel his pain? And, if you’re to be honest, isn’t it just fucking great!!!!

    Night night. Barcelona tomorrow.

  28. ecojon

    One of the issues that must be determined by the Army Top Brass is just who made-up the 400 members of the Armed Forced who attended Ibrox.

    It would appear that service personnel ‘volunteer’ to attend the Ibrox event and it would seem likely that the vast majority of those attending are Rangers supporters.

    I am therefore more of the opinion that it wasn’t the British Army on parade as we would normally understand it in that established and organised units were taking part. Instead it seemed that we had an ad-hoc collection of Rangers supporters in uniform and a helluva lot of them looked as though they needed some time back square bashing to learn how to march.

    What obviously united them wasn’t an esprit de corps but more a love for the baggage carried by Rangers and which a significant number of the 400 appeared to share with enthusiasm.

    There is no doubt that discipline collapsed and instead of an orderly march off the pitch the whole thing turned into a shameful spectacle which has cast a shadow over the British Army.

    Sadly a few squaddies will end-up carrying the can for this but the guilty parties IMO are to be found in Rangers using the visit of our Forces for PR purposes and also the total stupidity and lack of reality displayed by GOC Scotland Nick Eeles.

    He had enough of a warning from last year and had to ensure Saturday went off without a hint off a problem this year and he failed miserably which means his erse will be getting well and truly kicked from his bosses in London.

    • cam

      Send him another wee letter and tell him how to do his job.I’m sure he will appreciate good advice from Google napper.
      Do you think those paid thugs you referred to were on the pitch?

      Quick march bhoy back to barracks.

  29. lordmac

    the Brits, are finished as a peace keeping force in NORTHERN IRELAND
    as a result i can smell the clay of them, they like the rangers are dead.
    they are like a dug, with no teeth now, a gumsy bulldog and cant be trusted to be on parade no more even in the back yard, or home guard.

  30. @gortchomhor

    Can we all agree on one thing at least; that joining the army does not automatically make you a hero… A ridiculously stupid idea.

    A few of the people I knew when I was young joined up. There was nothing heroic about it. They joined because there was very little else open to them in terms of job prospects.

    If having close to zero job options and little or no education makes you a hero, then Glasgow must have one of the most heroic populations in the world. That’s right, those neds outside the chippy at night are heroes… Read it and weep.

    And let’s be honest, every country in the world thinks it’s got the best armed forces. It’s just something politicians say to win votes amongst under-achievers. I bet the people of Tajikistan think their army is the most heroic and professional and zzzzzzzzzzzzz

    God, why am I even reduced to discussing this junk. Oh well, while we are all here eh…

    Another thing — those heroes get paid. I wonder how many of them would do the job if they didn’t. I might have this wrong but isn’t it the case that someone who fights for money is a mercenary? Maybe someone can help me distinguish here, I’m obviously a bit thick.

    Finally, I’m no pacifist, but I think the world would be a much better place if we’d didn’t have any soldiers in it. Make of that childish analysis what you will. I’ll add this, though, since 1945 you’d struggle to find one clear example of what you might call a ‘just war’ that our heroes have been involved in.

    Before anyone gets emotional and talks about the parents of those who died in the corner of some foreign field, hear this; if it was up to me they wouldn’t have — they wouldn’t have been sent to fight, kill, and die in the first place.

    When you look at it like that, it’s the people who call them heroes and who unquestioningly lap up the lies about war and foreign policy that are to blame. Certainly not me so please spare me the bull…

  31. Felpen

    Great post Paul. But on your blog I love how the little sevco dog likes to bite then squeal when the big dhogs bite back. Ohh I am in outburst with outrage with that tim. I only tried to deflect and the dirty tim got my blood boiling with their reply! Why don’t they play go in their own league! You know the amateur one where they are! Just a thought!

  32. joe

    officer dibble
    September 30, 2013 at 8:38 pm

    For you Joe, happy days buddy.

    For some reason this made me think of HAIR the musical that I saw in the Greens Playhouse in Glasgow don’t know why anyway look at this from

    Act I

    Aquarius – Tribe and soloist (often Dionne)
    Donna – Berger and Tribe
    Hashish – Tribe
    Sodomy – Woof and Tribe
    I’m Black/Colored Spade – Hud, Woof, Berger, Claude and Tribe
    Manchester England – Claude and Tribe
    Ain’t Got No – Woof, Hud, Dionne and Tribe
    I Believe in Love – Sheila and Tribe trio
    Air – Jeanie, Crissy and Dionne
    Initials (L.B.J.) – Tribe
    I Got Life – Claude and Tribe
    Going Down – Berger and Tribe
    Hair – Claude, Berger, and Tribe
    My Conviction – Margaret Mead (tourist lady)
    Easy to be Hard – Sheila
    Don’t Put It Down – Berger, Woof and male Tribe member
    Frank Mills – Crissy
    Be-In (Hare Krishna) – Tribe
    Where Do I Go? – Claude and Tribe

    Act II

    Electric Blues – Tribe quartet
    Black Boys – Tribe sextet (three male, three female)
    White Boys – Tribe Supremes trio
    Walking in Space – Tribe
    Yes, I’s Finished/Abie Baby – Abraham Lincoln and Tribe trio (Hud and two men)
    Three-Five-Zero-Zero – Tribe
    What a Piece of Work Is Man – Tribe duo
    Good Morning Starshine – Sheila and Tribe
    The Bed – Tribe
    Aquarius (reprise) – Tribe
    Manchester England (Reprise) – Claude and Tribe
    Eyes Look Your Last – Claude and Tribe
    The Flesh Failures (Let the Sunshine In) – Claude, Sheila, Dionne and Tribe


    Just home from the Hydro – Oh what a night – Hail Hail – Rod the mod!!!

    The performance plus tomorrow nights extravaganza at Celtic Park shows-up the unwholesome Ibrox shenanigans at the weekend for what they were – crass and disrespectful to the vast majority of British people.

    The British military were used and abused by the Ibrox institution for their own purposes, just as HMRC have been the past twenty years.

    There must be a full enquiry into the organisation of this ‘slap in the face’ to the country, and it must NEVER again be repeated.

    Why should a club who have engaged in tax-avoidance and non-payment to the tune of £100 million over the past twenty years and who are awaiting the outcome of an HMRC tribunal have the right to use our armed forces for propaganda and sectarian purposes?

    Also one has to ask, after the ‘trousering’ of the Milan match money, exactly where the ‘so-called’ charity money raised will end up.

    The Rangers/Sevco’s five little badge stars stand for:

    • willy wonka

      JohnB, “Why should a club who have engaged in tax-avoidance and non-payment to the tune of £100 million over the past twenty years and who are awaiting the outcome of an HMRC tribunal have the right to use our armed forces for propaganda and sectarian purposes? ”

      Here’s an idea John – why don’t the Celtic board invite our brave armed forces over to Celtic Park and parade them there ?
      No ? Why not ?

      • Celtic park is a SPORTS ARENA,

        what have Armed Forces got to do with playing football ?

        for that matter
        What has Protestantism got to do with playing football.
        what has an anti catholic royal family got to do with playing football.
        what has Ulster Unionism got to do with playing football.
        What has King Billy’s Orange Order and 1690 got to do with playing football.

        all of the above are openly displayed on football scarf’s and Flegs of Rangers/Sevco FC

        • david

          What has Catholicism got to do with playing football?
          What has the Pope got to do with playing football?
          What has the IRA got to do with playing football?
          What have the politics of Ireland got to do with playing football?

          • willy wonka

            @ david, no reply was the answer.
            Fannies like coatbrig don’t think before posting. They just let their bile and hatred spew forth .
            All your questions are in vain. As tonights match will prove. From the deedly-dee music through to the songs praising murderers and terrorists.

            • jamie

              Just when I think things can’t get any more farcical you always prove me wrong, you are indeed the peepil!

          • coatbrigbhoy

            Celtic at no time in it’s history promoted Catholicism it never had an anti protestant agenda.

            Are you saying that you can buy Celtic supporters scarf’s and flags that support Catholicism.

            show me some photos, or photos of Celtic Scarf’s or flags that support the IRA.

            what songs are sung at Parkhead in support of the pope ?

            the politics of Ireland have nothing to do with football, yes, Celtic FC roots are Irish based,that’s a historical fact
            RFC roots are not Ulster based, Ulster played no part in the formation of RFC, that came along later along with the sickness that is Sectarianism/anti Irish racism,that is also a Historical fact of deadco’s history and it is now getting written into the first few pages of Sevco’s history

  34. joe

    Captain we seem to have gone back in time!
    Really Spock, tell me more.
    They seem to be very primitive people sir, I am picking up a transmission from one of their leader’s communication devices.
    Put it on audio Spock.
    Hullo hullo Greigs aye its Ally here its aboot ma ordur 4 stake bakes, 4 wee pizza slices……..whit kind .oh thurs two kinds well 4 of each wan then an 4 oh they cheese and onion lattice things, oh an a tin o diet coke am watching ma figure.
    Stop Sniggering oh shite a didny mean to say that a meant stop Sneggroing ah don’t want te be branded a racist as well as a bigot

  35. joe

    The news for Cam and Cryogenic napper.



  38. Brother Louis

    What a howler ! Honestly -how can the army have thought that this would have turned out well. Have they really so little awareness of the religious tensions that exist in Scotland (and are manifested in the Old Firm divide) – have they really so little awareness ? Do they not have experts to advise them on such things (and the risks associated with participating in such an event). I think that whoever in the army approved this ought to resign (for showing such terrible judgment if nothing else). As for the soldiers – I suspect that many (most ?) were not ‘real’ soldiers but were ‘terries’ wannabees who like to show off in the uniform, enjoy being feted as if they were veterans and have time on their hands.

    • Geddy Lee

      Nail on the Head. Senior Officers in London have no idea that sectarian hate bubbles away just under the surface of Scottish Society. They learned the hard way on saturday.

  39. Whilst it is only to be expected (unfortunately) that Rangers will be on the defensive regarding the disgraceful scenes on Saturday, and we have become used to the Scottish mainstream media ignoring – most of the time – any negative aspect emanating from Ibrox, I was astonished to witness The Scottish Football Monitor – that supposed mainstay of Internet Bampottery, and general thorn in the side of the Ibrox clubs – adopting a blanket censorship policy to comments on the matter, deleting most of them and making it clear that discussion on that particular subject was not allowed! It seems that that particular corner of social media has decided to follow the example of the mainstream media, and gag even decent and moderate free speech.

    I for one will not be returning to that site. Thankfully this site has a more enlightened policy on comments. The future does not belong to control but to collaboration. By letting people vent their feelings on an issue in a place where others will see it, they then feel included. And a representative cross section of opinion can then be aired. On the other hand, the censoring of comment that contains neither personal abuse nor vile invective, simply makes people feel trampled upon, and stokes up anger and frustration.

    The beauty of the internet is that it gives us so many options to circumvent control freaks who try to muzzle us. And todays publication of the story in the Scotsman represents another significant victory for social media against the forces of oppression – even within that social media – who would like to stifle the truth.

  40. StantheMan

    Scum! Utter scum! Paid for by the peoples taxes and when you see this filth parading their bigotry for all to witness, then we can see what the Irish nationalist community had to put up with. Vile, sectarian bigots who not only disgraced themselves but they have shown the world what they are all about. Mindless sectarian bigots. Everyone of them should be court-martialled and never allowed near a gun again. Dismissed in disgrace.

  41. Fra

    I will have to set my alarm for 2.45am but nothings gonny stop this proud Fenian from wakening the whole street. We are all Neil Francis Lennon. Come on you BHOYS in green. I just love being a Tim. HAIL HAIL.

  42. AntoniousF

    another successful mission by Agent Lawwell aka Maj General Nick Eeles. your Next mission, should you choose to accept it-

    destroy the BNP

    this post will self destruct in five seconds

  43. Project Walliams

    Annual Accounts Highlights
    Income 19.1mil
    Expenditure 33.6mil
    Loss 14.5mil
    Timeframe 13months =Loss 1.1mil per month loss (not 1mil at all!)
    Throw in Negative Goodwill (it’s a kind of magic) and out of the blue we now have a 1.2 mil profit
    Oh no you don’t – Oh yes we do – Oh no you don’t – Oh yes we do..ad infinitum
    Throw in note 14. net funds of IPO are being loaned by RIFC to RFCL as working capital (what all of it?)
    Add Note 19 8.2 mil season tickets income received but deferred (good news!)
    Add Note 20 tax liability 7.8mil (oops!) “No deferred tax asset has been recognised as it is not considered probable that there will be future taxable profits available in the foreseeable future to utilise the losses”. (to be expected – it is a football club and not a business)
    Gotta love Negative Goodwill
    , negative goodwill, negative goodwill, negative goodwill, negative goodwill

    Note the IPO reported staff costs as 1 mill per month for 45 players and 131 others – now we have 1.3mill per month for 50 players and 146 staff (maybe all those new board members )

    • Geddy Lee

      They still have a staggeringly high wage bill for a 3rd division club in ANY country. The problem will be keeping wages under control, the nearer they get to the SPL.

      They have splashed £1.7 Million on new tellys and WI-FI. That seems a staggering sum, again for a 3rd Division club…

  44. Geddy Lee

    The Military are currently running a very high profile “Equality” Programme.

    I can assure you, some very senior officers are apopleptic with rage, as saturdays disgraceful scenes, go against everything thery are trying to promote.

    On top of that, to act in such a manner, in the 21st century, is shamefully ignorant. Daly and the other catholic players at FC Sevcovia, must have “loved it”.

    It wil also have repurcussions in NI. Honestly, do none of them realise the damage they are doing with this kind of jingoistic behaviour5.

    • willy wonka

      @geddy , ” I can assure you, some very senior officers are apopleptic with rage, as saturdays disgraceful scenes, go against everything thery are trying to promote.”

      YOU can “assure” us ? REALLY ????
      Being ex forces myself and still having connections there, I’d be very interested in where your information is coming from Geddy.
      But let’s face it, it’s just another wee lie isn’t it ?

  45. This comment will be comment Number 123
    123 comments so far and not a single one from the most prolific poster on the blog,
    Steerpike has as yet, not managed to troll his way into this subject,
    it’s 11.00 am and still no positive spin on the subject of H.M. armed forces and their sectarian display, only a few days ago it was post after post after post about sectarianism, yet now when we have The Army, police Scotland and Sevco all investigating the Sectarian outburst at Ibrox over the weekend, Steerpike has vanished,
    what a failed wee troll he has turned out to be, his outlandish behaviour over the last couple off weeks was a sorry sight to behold,
    no doubt he will be on soon using his favourite fantasy figures to try to deflect from the issue, an issue that even some of the succulent lamb eaters have been forced to acknowledge.

  46. Fra
    October 1, 2013 at 8:47 am

    What an embarrassing shambles of a club. The difference from before is that the world has watched and didn’t like what they saw.

    But their followers aren’t in the least embarrassed, or if they are they keep it well hidden.

    Witness the pathetic attempts on here to defend but mainly to deflect from the antics at Ibrox on Saturday.

    The funny thing is, just as the previous club came to extinction by their own hands, Sevco fans are the authors of Saturday’s vulgar exhibition.

    What were those tits thinking when they posted such videos on youtube?

    Not thinking, probably…

  47. Carson ( cooler king )
    September 30, 2013 at 9:00 pm

    Shut it FUD !!

    What’s the matter?

    Is the pain too much to bear?

    Thick arsehole…

  48. The fault, if fault there be, lies with the service personnel who have mis-behaved whilst in uniform …and the Army/Police investigation will identify wrongdoers, if any.

    I do admire your eternal optimism….

  49. PJD

    What I can´t quite comprehend is this: Police Scotland and the Army/MoD are investigating the soldiers, sailors and flyers for “joining in” sectarian songs whilst in uniform and TRFC are helping them along with this.

    The underlying suggestion being that had they been among the 50,000 who started the sing-song they would be in the clear? After all, every MSM report that I have read says that TRFC are helping to investigate the squaddies whilst completely ignoring the foot soldiers in the stands!

  50. jamie

    Just how many football clubs in Britain have Armed Forces day celebrations ?

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