Rangers Suffer Defeat at the SFA Arbitration Panel – False Hopes and Winking Sheriffs

You might recall that I commented on a story on the Rangers website in early January, which was headlined “Rangers Compensation Claim Boost”.

As Rangers .co.uk reported at the time:-

RANGERS have made a successful start to their bid to win compensation for the players who walked out on the club last summer.

The club is chasing Allan McGregor, Kyle Lafferty, Jamie Ness, Stevie Naismith, Steven Whittaker and Sone Aluko for breaching their contracts. Compensation is also being sought from their clubs – Besiktas, Sion, Stoke City, Everton, Norwich City and Hull City.

A meeting took place on Monday at Hampden to discuss jurisdiction on the case and Rangers prevailed.

Chief Executive Charles Green told RangersTV: “From our side it went as well as we could have expected. From the other side I’m sure they will be disappointed. Clearly they wanted they commission to throw it out and rule that the SFA had no jurisdiction because the whole process of the first meeting was about jurisdiction.

“What we stated at the meeting was that newco wants to continue where oldco was. We have this slight anomaly where for a period newco were not members of the SFA from June 14 until being granted membership on August 3.

“It was those technical issues which caused some consternation but I was very encouraged with the meeting. It is still my position that these players breached their contracts and we are going to pursue them. With newco taking over from oldco – and BDO were at the meeting and withdrew from the process – is a fundamental part of it.

“Both parties were asked to go away and discuss various issues. We have been given until January 21 by the chair of the commission to come back to him. In the absence that the parties can’t agree or cannot come up with a view, he will make a judgement.

“Hopefully, though the lawyers, we can come up with an agreement on these issues and at that point then the commission can start taking the thing forward. We are quite a way off from the position we want to achieve in terms of gaining compensation.

Yesterday saw another story on the club website. (To be fair they cannot be accused of “burying bad news”).

This one is more prosaic.

Under the headline “SFA Arbitration Statement” it reads:-

RANGERS Football Club today received notification of the SFA Arbitration Panel’s decision which ruled that the Club did not inherit the right to continue the arbitration process started by oldco.

This was always a possible outcome of what was purely a procedural hearing.  Suspecting this would be the outcome, the Club had already filed a further Notice to Refer under SFA Article 99.  This was done before the end of last year and that process will now continue.

The Club had argued that since oldco’s registration had been transferred to newco the right to continue the case would also have transferred.

Nothing has been won or lost at this stage and the Club will continue with its action.

From reading what Mr Green had to say early in the month one might have got the impression that the issue of jurisdiction had been resolved in his company’s favour at that stage. Now it appears not to be the case.

It is common for parties to court cases and similar disputes to think the best (or the worst) of the outcome, depending on their psychological makeup. Often these guesses are far off the mark.

Many years ago I represented a client at an appeal before the Criminal Injuries Compensation Board. His claim had been rejected and he was challenging it. We attended at the hearing together. At one point one of the Board members popped his head out of the hearing room and asked the clerk to organise their mid-morning tea for five minutes hence. One minute later we were called in. I suspected that the Board did not envisage me being able to say very much! Put it this way – I suspected that we were unlikely to be successful, and so it proved, with the appeal being refused on every one of the six possible grounds for rejection. (To be frank, a victory would have been only losing on four!)

However, as we left the hearing room, my client turned to me and said, “I really thought we were winning that one!”

I commented that sometimes you hit the crossbar and sometimes it goes in.

Maybe Mr Green took a very positive outcome from the hearing, which sadly for him has proved to be less than accurate.

Or else he might have read the signals wrongly …

The story is told of a young lawyer (not me, I hasten to add) sent to a remote Sheriff Court to argue a complex and important case. As he started to make his way through his dense legal submissions, he glanced up at the bench to see the Sheriff winking at him. He took this as a good sign and ploughed on.

Looking up again, he caught another wink from the Sheriff. Believing that he was thus being told that he was on the right lines, he started to skip some of the more tedious sections of his brief. Each time he looked up, the Sheriff would wink in his direction.

Realising he was on a winner, he wound up his two hour submissions in around ten minutes, and returned happy to his Glasgow office to await the Sheriff’s written decision.

A couple of weeks later he was called into his Partner’s office. He could see that his boss had the judgement.

“What happened?” said the man behind the desk.

“I was on the Sheriff’s good side, and he agreed with everything I was saying, so I wound it up quickly so as not to annoy him.”

“And why did you think that?” asked the Partner.

“Because he kept winking at me”, came the reply. By this stage the young lawyer was starting to feel a little anxious.

“Sheriff (name redacted) was not winking at you! He has a twitch! And you lost the case because of what he described as your ‘cursory and unstructured argument, where none of your points were developed to the point of sense’!” bellowed the now angry solicitor.

“Can’t we appeal?” asked the young chap, seeing his great success, of which he had been boasting in the wine bars disappearing.

“On what grounds? That you thought the Sheriff was winking at you!”

————————————————

Maybe the SFA Panel Chairman was winking at Mr Green during the hearing?

So maybe Mr Green, who is clearly a positive chap, thought that things had gone well, or maybe he picked up the wrong impression?

It would be inappropriate and wrong to speculate that he was trying to place a deliberate “spin” on the hearing for PR purposes, and I will not have that accusation made against him. The statement that Rangers “suspected” this might be the outcome does not accord with what Mr Green had to say. Maybe he was more optimistic than his legal team?

On a serious note, Rule 99 which deals with the SFA resolving disputes between members, players and clubs has been invoked.

However I suspect that there will have been an opinion or two voiced by some Rangers fans that this is simply part of the SFA “vendetta” against the Ibrox outfit.

However it does raise an interesting point in the oldco/newco debate.

If the case is, as it seems to be, a claim by Rangers for compensation from players and clubs for breach of contract, then how was this ever a claim by oldco?

Surely the argument of Mr Green and newco is that, under the TUPE regulations, the players’ contracts passed automatically to newco. What claim therefore would oldco have? The only way in which oldco could have a claim would be if oldco in fact considered that the players had NOT transferred to newco, and thus broke their contracts by signing elsewhere.

If that is the position, then that expressly contradicts Mr Green’s position.

If it was possible for things in this saga to get more confused, then it looks as if they have!

In the same way as it is never over till the fat lady sings, it is never over till the judge issues his decision, winks or not!

Posted by Paul McConville

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303 Comments

Filed under Charles Green, Rangers, SFA

303 responses to “Rangers Suffer Defeat at the SFA Arbitration Panel – False Hopes and Winking Sheriffs

  1. ecojon

    The MSM re in a dire way but perhaps in so-called quality terms the Herald is just woeful and has given up the ghost in reporting terms.

    They have stated tonight:

    ‘If found guilty of wrongdoing by the Scottish Premier League appointed-commission, Rangers could face the ultimate sanction of being stripped of titles. The probe was launched before the original Rangers company was consigned to liquidation and the newco club have refused to recognise or co-operate with the investigation.’

    When was stripping the ‘ultimate’ sanction. Personally I judge it a slap on the wrist sanction compared to some others. And why no mention that the club and newco have now recognised the Commission. I think they must have pulled somebody in who was just passing-by to write the piece.

  2. lord mac

    when players agreed to take half wages with duff and Phelps there must have been some sort of agreement put up, even if it was to state they get all they are owed should
    the good times role, can the said player put a tax claim in for loss of wages.

  3. mick

    @LORD MAC a hope they cant as even halve there earnings is a couple of months wages to the man on the street the thing that looks odd is if whyte knew it was game over why did he not sell the players in fire sale is it because he thought throw a plan with d&ps and green and thought the players would tupe over and he would get secret shares via off shore so choose not to so the value would be more in long run lord hodge really has to get a move on

  4. Sweeney Hughes

    Nods n winks n winks n nods lol!

    Seems to be a running theme in this saga.
    What was the second cat fight between Chico Young and Jaba the ‘James’ Traynor, after they forgot themselves and argued live on air as to who was the biggest Murray bumboy?
    It was a nod or a wink from who? Alistair Johnstone?
    About what? Administration?
    And didn’t the Yorkshire stripper clame to have gotten the wink from HMRC about a CVA, or some such thing?
    Wasn’t he given the nod from Adidas?
    Didn’t he get the wink from some American fitty team or other?
    Wasn’t there a nod from some Aussy fitty team about an academy or something?
    Chico Green must. Know one helluva lota punters with tics, lol!!!!

  5. Mick you right , haven’t got a bloody clue what your taking about , but your right , it must be good to be right all the time , right ? anyway I hate not begin right , unlike you who is always right , what’s it like to be right all the time ? anyway have to go I’m making my dinner , hope it turns out all right , hear from you soon just checking you were all right .

    • mick

      your wrong mentioning borders we all know the underlying tone and thought of it your a vile racist

    • mick

      carson on January 31, 2013 at 4:04 pm said:

      Keep this post going Phil there on the run ! Trying to justify and explain their support for backstabbing cowards , real soldiers wear uniforms and face the enemy , real soldiers take prisoners in line with the Geneva convention , real soldiers don’t hide their ugly faces , real soldiers don’t complain to the police when one of them gets shot , real soldiers don’t complain when the enemy shoots back , real soldiers are paid they don’t sell drugs or extort money , real soldiers don’t use children as cover when firing , but the green seat brigade are that brainwashed , I blame the schools , they believe anything they are told , bill just one question do Britain operate an open border policy ? if so what’s stopping them leaving ?

      carson on the mc murdo blog

  6. Am I correct to say that if Chuckie never appeared at the LNS inquiry, he would find it very difficult to lodge an appeal? He did say he would not be there… But he was! Do you think he has had a wee whisper that it was not looking too good, so he thought he better pop his head in?

    • Don’t know to honest but you sum up the obsession with the mighty Rangers , do you think ? let’s speculate ! let’s have a show of hands ! my taxi driver told me ! just let the law lords do their job , if it goes against the mighty Rangers , so be it , well still show up and support them , if it goes for the mighty Rangers , there will still be the small minded bigoted and obsessed lynch mob wanting blood who won’t be able to accept it , just like the ftt , the eca ruling , lord nimmo smith view it’s the same club , nothing will change their hate , it’s the schools I blame , now shoot !!!!!

      • You sound in a bit of a bad mood Carson. Is the fact that Norwich opened the bidding for Hooper at a sevco, upped it to a Sevco and a hauf, then upped it again to 2 Sevcos getting to you.

      • Maggie

        @Carson
        It’s the schools I blame….Seriously is that your actual belief?
        What do you blame denominational schools for ?
        Have you ever spent a day in one?
        Do you know anyone who teaches or works in one?
        Do you know any children who attend one?

        Well, I spent my first career teaching in denominational or faith
        schools and there is nothing but tolerance and respect taught by
        the staff in these schools.Football colours aren’t allowed to be
        worn during PE or any extra curricular sports activities or at
        any time whatsoever. If any child in any school I ever worked in
        had used any sectarian,racist or homophobic language then
        it would have been made clear to them the unacceptability
        of such language,and suitable punishment meted out.
        All world religions are taught and field trips to mosques,
        synagogues and temples are part of the curriculum.
        If you knew anything about the work load of teachers,then you
        would know,there is simply not enough time to teach sectarianism
        too.That’s sarcasm btw.

        You should be ashamed of yourself for your comments on that
        disgrace of site of Mc Murdo’s,I’m SO sorry I clicked on the link
        to it,to say the comments are vile is an understatement.I feel
        like a stranger in my own country,tho’ it seems you and Bill
        Mc Murdo don’t seem to think it is my country.
        Please return to it as you obviously feel at home there.
        Why do you even post on here if you hate us “manky
        unwashed timmigrants” so much? Do you have a vile
        epithet for the Scots Italians who attend faith schools or
        for the Jewish children,or the Asian,Chinese and Eastern
        European children,all religions and races that I have taught
        in the schools you blame for…..what is it we’re being blamed
        for again? …….
        NB don’t not make any attempt to engage me in any debate
        on this issue as I’ve said all intend to about it.

        • Steven brennan

          Maggie
          I dont think he is worthy of any reply, i would probably have stuck his head down the toilet at school.
          Please miss it wisnae me, as she wanders off knowing exactly who and what was going on.
          If he was a sick chicken a wouldnt even wring his neck.

        • maggie so proud of you excellent post

          • Maggie

            @tommie20
            Thanks tommie,I’m sick of being accused of bigotry by these
            “peepul” and let’s not forget the usual “it’s the schools I blame”
            Well I’m sick to death of my integrity and professionalism,and
            that of my friends and colleagues,being called into question.
            Still furious this morning. 😦

        • @Maggie

          Excellent response considering his shit (pardon my French) doesn’t merit the attention – I know that’s a bit hypocritical as I responded to it as well, but certainly not in such a well written or dignified manner as your good self.

    • ecojon

      @barcabuster

      IMHO I think the NEDS on the board of Rangers International might have had something to do with it. I think some may have worried that not to be represented might be regarded as a corporate governance issue especially in view of the available penalties such as expulsion, non-quantified financial penalties and who knows what ele if guilt is established.

      Lodging the appeal isn’t difficult and won’t be affected probably but winning it is another kettle of fish and I don’t think turning-up at the last minute will be viewed very favourably and the public utterances of chuckles may well come baack to haunt him.

    • @barcabuster

      Could it have been a whisper from the institutional investors to wind his neck in? It would, as you say, make things very difficult to mount an appeal if newco weren’t represented.

      I know that the prospectus carried the “no duristiction” bumpf but maybe they’ve taken proper legal advice & spotted the potential problem.

  7. Mick , you think being called manky is racist !

  8. mick

    carson your sick and scum in my eyes after reading what you posted your a sick vile prick leave our schools out of your sick rants ,o and 1 mans army soildier is another mans terrorist just ask the men that were raped by red necks in iraq

    • Maggie

      @mick
      Hi mick,I’m disgusted by those vile posts.and all the abuse
      you receive from that “shower” of….. For once the thesaurus in my
      brain has let me down mick,I just can’t think of a suitable word for
      them….and I most certainly will never revert to their style of rhetoric.
      You know what’s just dawned on me,they’re the only ones who
      resort to personal abuse and name calling.
      Must be worried bout LNS finishing early.

  9. mick

    thats his holyness just of the phone to LNS demanding expultion of newco or am i thinking like a hurting bear lol

  10. Stand by every word , but then people who idolise terrorists would be offended , do you support terrorism Michael ? or do you support our brave soldiers preserving YOUR freedom ?

    • not nearly dead but really dead

      Carson, hmmmmm… I know that name from somewhere. Wasn’t there a fella in history who illegal took up arms against the crown and the will of of the people(not ra peepul) and created a state whose borders he wasn’t born within and subjected one party rule on the populace……..nah I must have been dreaming

    • mick

      a dont support any violence in any shape or form the tougne is mighter than the sword thats my motto ,and for you asking do you support our brave soldiers preserving YOUR freedom thats a msm myth freedom was at risk your a nut nut millions of people have died and been displaced and maimed via the iraq and afgan war it was not for my freedom it was for oil and contracts but you being thick as would not understand this who ever sent the uk troops to war for nothing will rot in hell and any man with a button fireing missles at house with kids will get a similiar vate

  11. not nearly dead but really dead

    Breaking news……….. Norwich to use rejected hooper bid money and purchase t’rangers with 54 titles and £500,000 left over!!!

    • Glad you’ve recognised that the mighty Rangers have 54 titles , and when they take their rightful place as the country’s premier club , the green seat brigade still won’t have caught up !

      • not nearly dead but really dead

        Eyes will see what they want to see, I said t’rangers as in ‘the rangers’ the only registered club with that in their name formed in govan in 2012 , seeing as I right this tonight it is 54 titles according to some and I stress some reports from the SFA. But come the next few weeks 54 may dwindle a few and the SFA arbitration committee may have woken up to the fact that it is indeed a new club after all with no titles. Rules eh…… there a bugger but don’t apply to …. ah you know the drill.

        Rightful place…hahahahahahahaha, German lad tried that once, didn’t end well though.

  12. mick

    carson is twisted and thinks the wars were for freedom am no rocket sicentist but even a seen throw bush and bliar and there lies at least cameron is pulling them out ,a wonder who got all the divid end money via the companys suppling the troops know theres something worth debateing

  13. GARY HOOPER UPDATE

    Celtic are still adamant that striker Gary Hooper is going nowhere.

    BBC Scotland’s Chris McLaughlin reports that another Norwich bid has been received and rejected. The offer is valued at around £9million.

    £9m !!! that’s 50% more than Charlie boy Green was trying to get for all those that refused to TUPE over.

  14. Frankie Bhoy

    Can someone not ban Carson he is a FUD!

  15. Gary Hooper update ……..breaking as we speak!!!!!! ?… an unnamed club has put in a 25m bid ! 24m up front 1m by end of next Tuesday , Lennon and liewell have said he’s going nowhere ! were holding out for 3million .

    • tykebhoy

      Are Norwich setting a world record in not losing a lot of money to a Scottish club for two seasons in a row.

      Granted this year if they had offered enough money they would have got a player for their money. Last year had they accepted the offer they would have lost a player despite the fact the team, now deid, couldn’t pay them anything above a derisory down payment. They would still be well out of pocket now

  16. mick

    am glad hes staying we need him for the final in london mon the hoops get on twitter to the vatician and sort it lol via our timmy pals at eufa

  17. Sensational news ! Jim whyte has even took a whitey ! Norwich and the ” unnamed ” club have both lodged bids of 30million ! again treacle teeth has said ” look we told them it’s 3 million or nothing , do they think were daft “

    • Steven brennan

      Carson
      I dont usually reply to your posts, however you seem to be boiling over with rage and abuse this evening.
      Whats bothering you?
      Go lie down in your cot and think about your behaviour, and when you understand what you have done wrong come and apologise.
      Then and only then will you be allowed to take the pointy hat off and re- join the conversation.
      Off you go

      • This is me in a good mood !

      • Maggie

        @Steven Brennan
        I’m disgusted with him Steven.it’s one thing defending and
        backing your football club,but quite another to spout the bile
        that’s found on Mc Murdo’s site.
        I took him for some “hadn’t ever grown up,big daft laddie”
        that you could poke harmless fun at,and get a laugh with.
        Now it seems we’re manky unwashed timmigrants,who all
        support the IRA.
        It’s all attack,attack,attack,insult,insult,insult.
        See my earlier post to Paul re L Ron Hubbard’s take on being
        an attack dog.
        Maybe they’re all Scientologists,God I hope soar,as they’re even
        more reviled that Catholics.

        • Steven brennan

          Maggie
          I have an early start in the morning, so I will bid you goodnight.
          Some of the people who post on here have an agenda and cannot resist abusing anyone who disagrees.
          Carson has proved to be a horrid vindictive eejit, but on the flip side Mick should no better than to stoop.
          Guys have a wee think before you answer, if you dont like it you have a choice to ignore or attack. When you choose attack dont be at twat.
          cool concise and correct will always win the day
          . Education Education Education.

        • Steven brennan

          Maggie
          I never click the links as it only leads to someone with an agenda.

  18. JohnBhoy

    @carson

    A conservative estimate of 132,000 civilians died in the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, mainly as a result of US-led bombing raids (‘The Cost of War since 2001: Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan, Brown University, June 2011) and annual reports by the UN, such as ‘Treatment of Conflict-Related Detainees in Afghan Custody, January 2013’, continually highlight evidence of torture by ‘real’ soldiers.

    Indiscriminate shock and awe aerial bombing and disregard for human rights is hardly evidence that “real soldiers wear uniforms and face the enemy, real soldiers take prisoners in line with the Geneva convention, real soldiers don’t hide their ugly faces”.

    • I never once disputed any stats from any conflict , I pointed out , and stand by what I said , that real soldiers face the enemy and do not hide behind children when firing , unlike the ” heroes ” that are worshiped by the green seat brigade , civilians have sadly been caught up in every conflict , and sadly will again , as long as cowardly terrorist scum hide behind them , again I do not dispute your figures sadly they are too true , but I will not apologise for slagging off clowns who try to make a comparison between real soldiers and terrorists .

      • Jamie

        You mean like those “real Soldiers” who shot innocent people at Croke Park….The state sanctioned killings of catholics in Ireland….the atrocities carried out by the Black & Tans. Typical Sevconian attitude and air brushed view of history.

        You sir are a bigot and symptomatic of the cancer that inflicts this country. You appear at home on the McMurdo site why don’t you stay there and be in your element with the rest of your ilk.

        • Cregganduff

          Real Police & Real Soldiers
          During the 1970s, a secret alliance of loyalist militants, British soldiers and RUC officers known as the Glenanne gang carried out a string of sectarian attacks against Catholics. Former members have alleged it was commanded by British Military Intelligence and/or RUC Special Branch. The Pat Finucane Centre has attributed 87 killings to the Glenanne gang, including the Dublin and Monaghan bombings (1974), the killing of John Francis Green, the Miami Showband killings (1975), and the Reavey and O’Dowd killings (1976). A number of these attacks has been affirmed by Glenanne gang member and RUC officer John Weir, who claimed that his superiors knew the collusion was taking place.

      • not nearly dead but really dead

        your vilifying someone as you say ‘ supporting terrorist scum and cowards hiding behind children, but there are many people in countries around the world who could lay that charge at ‘your’ army and if you do a quick ‘google’ im sure you could find the reasons why… now i abhor regimes and others who kill and mistreat people but dont pontificate on here that ‘your army’ is beyond reproach and merely saying ‘civilians caught up as to deflect ‘your army’s’ responsibility is just not good enough to explain possible illegal wars/oil grabs. You are not more patriotic by wrapping the flag around you and shouting how loyal you are, i’m afraid that is the language of children ,not adults………………
        oh… and by the way your post and subsequently mine has F@~k all to do with a 4th tier football franchise

      • Steven brennan

        The only difference is the reporter, or the victor.
        Each and every army commits atrocities

      • http://alethonews.wordpress.com/2011/05/18/british-colonial-war-crimes-in-1950s-kenya-mau-mau-rebellion-whitewashed/

        “The one woman claimant was subjected to sexual torture. White soldiers repeatedly inserted bottles of boiling hot water into her vagina. In addition to these cases, thousands of Kenyans were maimed, lynched and brutally murdered by the British during the last century. Thousands of others were subjected to rape, forced labor, and gross abuse and torture in detention camps. It was part of a deliberate policy of the colonial British government to break a civilian population cast as “baboons,” “barbarians,” and “terrorists” and who were seen as a threat to the colonial order in east Africa.”

        • ecojon

          @coatbrigbhoy

          However I wouldn’t want you to think that the British State wasn’t even-handed on a colour basis.

          You have to remember that when fighting the Boers in South Africa they introduced the concept and reality of Concentration Camps – a 100 years nefore another madman – where unknown numbers of Boer women and children died of starvation and illness through total neglect and starvation.

          Another glorious period in British Colonial history which was always based on economic exploitation of foreign lands, their people and resources. And nothing has changed to this day, sadly. And our boys and girls are still sent to do their duty an die for profit.

      • JohnBhoy

        @carson

        If you consider the IRA to be “cowardly terrorist scum” because they didn’t wear a uniform etc, then you would not hold a different view of the UDA. Correct? What about those who fought against Franco? A uniform is only proof of a budget and state-approved killers, nothing more.

        By continually targeting one class of Irish diaspora, I suspect that your views on “terrorists” – and your classification of all Celtic supporters as “sordida pleb” (the great unwashed) – are coloured by racial and religious prejudices rather than dictated by any disapproving reference to moral turpitude.

        • Steven brennan

          JohnBhoy
          Like the nightterror, Bob Smith, The blue Tit( gooseysomething)
          Carson is quickly becoming persona non grata.
          I will try to ignore his posts until he reigns his neck in and puts the alter ego back in the cupboard.
          Its a wee shame that someone who can contribute becomes Dr Jeckyll

          • JohnBhoy

            Steven,
            I previously took the view that carson was secretly a decent spud who put on an obnoxious persona just to see how far he could upset people and that every time he posted he was killing himself laughing. Maybe he’ll return to being just daft without the bile.

            • ecojon

              @John Bhoy

              The problem I have with that is we seem to be infested with posters who when taken to task for vile posts seem to think all they need to say is I was only joking or can’t you take a joke.

              Humour is often used as a cover for barbed insults and the dissemination of intolerance in my experience.

            • Maggie

              @ecojon &JohnBhoy
              You’re absolutely correct ( as always ) eco.
              That’s the way it goes with them….all fun and games
              until somebody loses an eye….. or in their case the vitriol
              comes out.I know I’ve said this before to you,but it’s when
              they’re out gunned because they’re trying to defend the
              indefensible.You bhoys are all too sharp for them….
              Obviously Mc Murdo winding them up in readiness
              for deflecting blame onto Peter Lawwell for the findings
              of the LNS tribunal…..poor Peter,he’s laughing all the way
              to the last 16 of the Ch League.

            • Den

              I gave Carson a chance, even if he drops the bile I won’t have anything to do with him.

              I really can’t be bothered with the wind up merchants. Winding folk up just to get an angry reaction is quite malicious, but maybe I just lack the sense of humour.

              I questioned some dubious comments and the answer was ‘just joking’. Talk about laugh – I didn’t.

              unfortunately it is hard to poke fun in writing in a way that doesn’t offend and easy to be offensive and then blame the receiver for lack of humour.

      • “civilians have sadly been caught up in every conflict”

        Hope you’re including the poor pensioners in Short Strand whose homes were petrol-bombed by masked Loyalist thugs hell-bent on overturning the democratic decision to only fly their “fleg” on designated days.

        Like some of the very reasonable & normally forgiving commenters to this blog, this is the last time I will respond to anything you post as you have proved in black and white & for all to see what a thoroughly obnoxious, small-minded bigoted racist you really are.

        • ecojon

          @rabthecab

          When carson must have been on his/her medication I responded to some reasonable posts but they quickly deteriorated with no answers given and an outpouring of bile so I too no longer respond.

          • @eco

            IMO “reason” went out of the window in his comments on Paul’s blog of 19th (Predictions) and the bile has been bubbling nearer & nearer the surface ever since.

            A Cyndi Lauper tune springs to mind.

  19. Carl31

    I assume Mr Mure QC is the same Mr Mure that sat on the FTTT, and decided in Rangers favour?

    I wonder if the same standards that have been applied to the involvement of Harper McLeod in the SPLIC, will be applied to Mr Mure’s work here and opinion in th FTTT, by those in the blogosphere who read more into a situation than is actually there.

    IMO such conspiracy theories are stuff of fantasy, but such silence on Mr Mure shows the extreme bias of the claims made around Harper McLeod.

  20. JimBhoy

    Fuk sake I thought we were discussing chico losing a small case that realistically he was never gonna win, I come back on and it’s all things terrorists,, soldiers, songs et al…

    I have family who were in the british army, my da was, god rest his soul… Wars aren’t about anything other than politicians/ (royals of old) looking to make gains, financially or otherwise. My old history teacher discussed the russo-japanese war, a wee venture to rile the masses to back him ( a little convenient war, is memory serves), the Czar at the time. They got their Asses kicked.

    The US armies are fed, armed and clothed by companies close to a lot of politicians who can vote for military actions, sounding like Michael Moore now but check that out..

    The British army apart from being part of a peace keeping force in the UN should be a force of defence. We are an Island how much defence does that need?

    On our shores the real fight these days should be against those who supply drugs to kids, traffic other vulnerable human beings, loan sharks, knife gangs, paedo rings, organised crime and terrorism of any nature.. Let the army assist the police in sorting that lot out instead of manouvres to invade other countries as the yanks puppets.. We are not the nation we were and thank fuk for that, we have done some good in countries but we have also caused havoc. Recently for mineral rights if truth be told… Pretty hypocritical but I get emotional for every British esp Scottish soldier who loses a life policing a country we have no fekin right to be in… I put myself in the place of their parents…

    My son is keen on an joining the RAF (Like me) , maybe that’s why the above statements grate on me…

    I also had a pal whose v young son (18 i think) was lost in an Ira ambush (as a soldier), I would never defend any terrorism and can recall my pal’s grief many years ago as he came to grips with that, sadly he didn’t, RIP.

    Be Civil…We’re all the same…

  21. JohnBhoy

    Enough of carson.

    Transcript from official court record:

    Lawyer: “What was the first thing your husband said to you when he woke that morning?”
    Witness: “He said, ‘Where am I, Cathy?'”
    Lawyer: “And why did that upset you?”
    Witness: “My name is Susan.”

  22. JimBhoy

    I hope Paul can release my last statement must have been caught up in the moderation trap. It’s not contentious in any way just some thoughts and the benefit of my experience being somewhat in the middle (or oblivious) of the religious thing. I look forward to replies… I did swear a little ;( Paul knows my general views (i hope)….

  23. JimBhoy

    Can’t believe the hedgehog is fighting for his life, Prick ly fella… Another Good Celtic man, surprised a man of his talent had blood flow probs, Scored many many times,

    Ok I’ll get my coat for the second time today…

  24. Steven brennan

    Goodnight all
    Animals need fed in morning regardless of which team they support.
    Ps they are all celtic supporters or sausages.

  25. Earlier the talk of courtrooms triggered this old memory from 20 years back..I part witnessed a wee desperate but rather comical Glasgow district court appearance once around the early 90’s involving a rough scruffy looking individual repeat offender brought up on a charge of  drunk & disorderly, breach of the peace & bail act offence etc etc,.

    I think the magistrates name was Sheeran , someone who apparently was very strict no nonsense type, struck the fear into the boys & girls who where in custody that morning when the turn keys announced who was the one residing on the bench to make the decisions regarding bail or custody, so my friend informed me, prisoner 😦 me, visitor outside in court room 😉

    Anyhow the bloke (Jekyl&Hyde) after meeting with his solicitor who was representing him decides to plead guilty, so inside the courtroom the lawyer starts to give the magistrate the lads brief background blah blah, and his client see’s himself as a bit of a Jekyl & Hyde type of character who when under the influence of Alcohol his character Hyde takes control,  thus becoming regretfully a nasty piece of work, which is something he is massively ashamed of when he sobers up, someone which JECKYL finds very dificult to live with & come to terms with that side of his (Hyde) nature, & squeal about going to rehab if released.. blah blah…

    Anyway….The magistrates skims over several bits of paper(s), prosecutor rambles on hurriedly in legal jargon, magistrate takes everything into consideration, another quick scan of more paper(s) passed to him & the heartfelt pleas & confession of guilt rehab blah blah & offers JECKYL the mock sympathy etc, to everyones surprise admonishes Mr JECKYL….

    ‘ Then a slight pause from magistrate/judge ‘…..

    Prosecutor/lawyer etc silently exchanging confused looks…

    Big chesire cat grin from MR HYDE with big sigh of relief believing he has pulled the wool over the eyes of the court.. ‘Liberty’…. ….

    BUT….few seconds pause over…

    Magestrates/judge..” MR HYDE unfortunately this court which you are no stranger to with your repeat offending leaves me with no option but to therefore sentence you to 3 months imprisonment HMP instead on the charge of breach of the peace, then the other charges it was more months and concurrently blah blah jargon…..

    But suddenly at that moment the goody two shoes butter wouldnt melt in my mouth rehabilitated mask slips from MR JECKYL, having just been toyed with by the magistrate/judge, he growls out in his anger knowing its now custody….

    “Och Fur Fek Sake It’s A Doddle Man, Al Dae That Nae Fekn Botha Staunin Oan Ma Heed Man” :-\   (aggressive gesticulating & swerry mouth Hyde)….

    And instantly sharp as a tac the magistrate replies ..

    ” Well MR HYDE when your done with standing on your head, here is another 3 month consecutive for contempt of court  that will help MR JECKYL get himself back up on his Feet”…. Court erupts in laughter as Jeckyl & Hyde gets ushered back through side door en-route Bar-L custody cell..F

    For me this is my perception of all this Charlie ‘The Promiser’ Green’s newco/oldco/Jeckyl & Hyde nonsense, “All very Comical, Hillarious & entertaining, but so Sad & Desprate….Send em down M’lord!!

    REPEAT OFFENDERS!!!!

    P.S Great blog Paul, been lurking daily for a while and you got numerous contributors also with valuable informative input..Please keep up the good work all..Thank you.. A greatful lurker..

    FTB88

    • ecojon

      @feedthebear88

      Your tale reminds me of a sheriff in a county court who shall be nameless even though now long gone but I still have connections with his family.

      When the accused stood in front of him awaiting sentence he would say: ‘Well Mr X what am I going to do with you. Should I sentence you to 6 months or give you probation with an order to undergo alcohol counselling again. What do you think?’

      The accused would plump for the probation and the Sheriff would say: ‘Well I’m sorry to disappoint you but I’m afraid I have to sentence you to 6 months’.

      Four months later the same man would be back in the same dock, facing the same Sheriff and facing the same question. This time he told the Sheriff that he thought he shoul get the six months inside for the Sheriff to comment: ‘Yes my feelings exactly’.

      As he was led to the cells the look in his eyes was priceless and also in the eyes of everyone else who fell for it down the years. Still, when he wasn’t being inventive to stop himself falling asleep the Sheriff concerned was light years ahead of his time with innovative sentencing and I have never ever come across anyone who devoured SERs and questioned social workers as intensely to ensure he knew the score in cases he thought he could make a difference in terms of life outcomes.

  26. JimBhoy

    http://www.dothebouncy.com/home/content.php?311
    ffs sake it embarassed me then and this embarasses me now.. Let’s stop making fukin causes.. It’s a football match, Celtic gave as much or more to the poppy cause for whatever that means, stop the side taking and grasping at anything you think might give you an advantage. Look what happens when you think gives that advantage… I dunno what motivates people who try to gain shield rattling advantages to these situations but I will say the powers that be to let that happen should be taken to task..

    Celtic supporters do not like/dislike (delete where appropriate) the British Army was that the point? FFS get a life… I love marmite, hate council lay offs, hate politics…

  27. JohnBhoy

    Rangers to be Stripped of Titles! (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/19702547)

    Not so, but I just wanted to see what that heading looked like in print.

  28. dan

    Areson, Arseon! Are you seriously asking us to believe that ‘our boys’ in uniform are all whiter than white? For fucks sake, come on! Have you really never heard of the Saville Inquiry? (No, not that one). Have you really never heard of Bloody Sunday? Have you really never heard of atrocities committed by ‘our boys’ in Aden, Malaya, India, and almost every other outpost of the ‘Empire’ on which ‘the sun never set’. (Because, courtesy of Gorgeous George Galloway. ‘God didn’t trust them in the dark.’). Were you lads in the Catering Corp, really so sheltered from the truth? Jesus, I wasn’t even in the army and I got the dope straight from the horses’ mouths, i.e., men who had served as either professional soldiers or National Service conscripts. Grow up or shut up for fucks sake.

    Oh and this terrorist kick your on: ever heard of The Stern Gang? They were a bunch of Jewish ‘terrorists’ responsible for the deaths of many British soldiers. Awful people—-even hung some of ‘our boys’ in orange groves. Yet some of their members ended up running Israel and being feted by US and British governments. History is littered with examples of how people demonised by colonial powers are suddenly rehabilitated when the colonial powers in question no longer have the stomach for the fight and feel the need ‘to talk’. This is not to excuse acts of terror such as blowing up or shooting innocent people, or, as you say, using them as human shields. But don’t try and portray it as a black and white issue. It just makes you sound a bit stupid. I mean, think about this, when did Britain begin to entertain the notion of talks with the IRA? When innocent people on a night out were slaughtered in pubs? Or on the streets? Or in places of worship? Nah. But one bomb in the City of London seems to have done the trick.

    Areson, believe it or not, I don’t know the words to a single ‘rebel song’. It’s not how I was brought up. Such songs tend to romanticise a sordid business that I want no part of–even at the safe remove of a football ground.

  29. RayCharles

    It must be wonderful to see the world so clearly that it is possible to be absolutist and unwavering in your beliefs.

    Unfortunately I have never been blessed by such insight.

    I struggle to comprehend matters so incisively.

    Instead, I see lots of competing narratives and continually battle to try to create some sort of workable understanding as best I can.

    I think it is fair to say that I am plagued by this psychological affliction and live in a “fuzzy” world where very little is black and white.

    In fact, the more I try to discern the “truth” about something the more confused I get.

    As Dick Cheney might have said: “The more you know the more you know there is to know.”

    But Cheney is not alone in his quandaries as Plato once said: “Wisest is he who knows what he does not know.”

    Socrates added, “The more I learn, the more I learn how little I know.”

    Laozi stuck his tuppenseworth in and said: “The more you know, the less you understand.”

    While I agree with Plato and Socrates’ analysis I am not convinced by Laozi’s view.

    Or maybe I just can’t understand what he is saying.

    Which brings me to Carson.

    He asked if people supported terrorists.

    This subject immediately starts to get a bit fuzzy for me.

    I have admired quite a few although my perceptions have sometimes changed over time.

    I remember when the Mujahideen were battling the Russians in Afghanistan.

    While I had great sympathy for the Russian conscripts, I felt the indigenous guerilla forces involved in the resistance movement held the moral high ground.

    Next thing I know, it turns out that many of the Mujahideen had been trained and armed by the Saudis who exported their regressive Wahhabist beliefs into a tribal culture that actually had many progressive aspects to it.

    The result was that 1400 year old statues of Buddha were soon blown up, books were burnt and girls were denied an education.

    A large section of the Mujahideen morphed into the Taliban.

    Now the Mujahideen are “terrorists” battling American and British forces.

    From plucky guerillas to nasty terrorists in one easy step.

    Look at Nelson Mandela. He went the other way, from a UK Government perspective.

    From being branded a “terrorist” by Mrs Thatcher to being an global icon of freedom without even moving from his jail cell.

    Then there is the historical IRA.

    In May 2011 the British monarch laid a wreath in Dublin at a memorial dedicated to “all those who gave their lives in the cause of Irish Freedom”.

    Among those groups recognised on the memorial are the Irish Republican Army.

    This was reported at the time as the British State finally recognising that those involved in fighting to create the Irish State were no longer to be classified as “terrorists” or “rebels” by Her Majesty’s Government but as legitimate freedom fighters.

    I can understand the reasons behind this change in understanding although it certainly took a while.

    It appears the Provisional IRA is also now in the process of being given a makeover by the British State.

    The Queen even met and shook hands with Martin McGuiness, after all.

    The Real IRA and the Continuity IRA are now the “terrorists”.

    The goalposts have moved again.

    I, like Elizabeth II, am inclined to classify the Republicans from the Easter Rising as a group of people worthy of some respect.

    I am still undecided about the Provos, however.

    Would I shake hands with Martin McGuinness?

    Yes. Just like Ian Paisley and the British monarch have done.

    Do I see the Provos as freedom fighters or terrorists?

    I am still edging towards the terrorist side at this moment.

    If I am still here in 20 years maybe my views will soften – or maybe they will harden.

    I can certainly see the argument for recognising them as freedom fighters.

    I can also see the argument that their tactics tainted the cause of Republicanism, Irish or otherwise.

    In saying that, the Reign of Terror hasn’t really marred the legacy of French Republicanism and I always feel like standing to attention when I hear the Marseilles.

    The passage of time, perhaps, leads to a better understanding.

    Although, I would like to point out that when Chinese premier Zhou Enlai famously said it was “too early” to assess the implications of the French revolution, he was actually referring to political turmoil in France in 1968 and not the more distant upheaval of 1789, as is often stated.

    Sorry for such a long, meandering post but, as I said, I live in a fuzzy reality and it is sometimes difficult to express myself succinctly – especially after a few beers.

    Anyway, I am sure the likes of Carson will intuitively “know” for a “fact” that I am talking a lot of rubbish without even having to think about.

    I can only bow to their great wisdom.

    • Den

      Ray Charles

      Brilliant post.

      It is a burden trying to keep an open mind.

      Carson’s contribution has marked a low point, however some of the contributions in response have been outstanding.

      Thank you

      • ecojon

        @Den

        Carson has achieved her or his purpose of deflecting and harming this blog. The vile troll has dragged the discussion onto areas of her/his choosing which are little more than an attack on all apects of Catholicism and as part of that agenda he/she has attempted to cover her true agenda by involving Celtic supporters and by extension Celtic FC.

        There are no outstanding contributions in response to his/her vile spewings because all the time wasted on replying to his/her posts shifts the perspective off all the things that are currently wrong with Scottish football

        And if I have ruffled feathers of those who reply to Carson’s rants then just remember he/she doesn’t care what you post as it is just another victory for her agenda. This is not about debate it is about supremacy and against people with a fixed mind you can never ever debate or get them to entertain a contrary opinion

        I realise that this blog ranges over a wide spectrum of topics but I ask all the good posters on here, and that includes Rangers fans, to reflect on what is going on here with Carson and the small band of supporters involved.

        I don’t know if they are even Rangers supporters or just trolls paid to be on here to deflect and deny.

        The best advice as always is don’t feed the trolls. When you do we lose sight of the Arbitration Committee decision and the LNS Hearing and end up with utter sh*te from a poisonous and thoroughly nasty people.

        Sadly some posters fall victim to a rush of blood to the head, I have and I almost always regret it, and reply in kind to the trolls. Look at the debate we were having here yesterday while the trolls were absent and then look at it when they arrived back and see how everything changed and the blog sank into the slime they create.

        • @Ecojon
          I can only agree with you, I got sucked into it, I have resolved to put a mental picture in place of that wee woman in the link every time i read a post from Carson

          • ecojon

            @coatbrigbhoy

            I have as well but I always realise later that not only is it pointless but that I have descended into their sewer.

            Sadly the wee woman is a product of her upbringing in a hate-filled society and we can all only hope that better days lie ahead for ALL citizens of Northern Ireland come sooner rather than later.

            It will take time but the vast majority there want peace and just to move on with their lives. They are slowly realising that the old days have all but gone but it is at this juncture when extremists realise their grip on power is going that they are at their most dangerous so they are threshing-about in their Last Hurrah.

        • Maggie

          @ecojon
          I take your point eco and I agree that their objective is to
          disrupt,but I’m sorry,I will always defend my position against bullies
          and dissemblers,especially when my professional integrity is
          called into question.I did not spend half of my working life teaching
          in denominational schools to sit back and have some low life bigot,
          state that they are the source of all sectarianism.
          I am incredibly proud of the work of faith schools and especially
          the pastoral care given by the staff ( of all religions,and none btw )
          to the children.For me it was always the most fulfilling aspect of my
          job.Of course academic achievement is important,but it’s more
          important that some wee soul knows they are valued and cared for
          in a safe environment and safe relationship with their teacher.
          I will most certainly NOT let all my good work and that of my
          friends and colleagues be denigrated.

          • Den

            Maggie,

            Support what you believe in by all means and if I could express myself in writing like you do I would also.

            Just remember you are dealing with a troll, a nasty piece of work that in troll mode is impervious to reason. Don’t waste too much time on them.

            If you want to tell the rest of us about the good things you see and have seen go right ahead, I like to hear of the good stuff that is going on.

            • Maggie

              @Den,
              I really appreciate your support and kind words.I normally try
              to make fun of their idiocy,but I’m afraid it was the slur on my
              profession that I found so offensive in this instance,and the fact
              that any adult in a position of trust,with a genuine love of
              children and a desire to see ALL of them achieve their full potential,
              would sully their minds with vile sectarianism.
              Like you Den,I shall never respond again to any provocation by
              these trolls.

              Btw you do yourself a disservice,I always find your posts interesting
              and amusing.

            • Den

              Maggie,

              I put heart and soul into my posts and you laugh at them. Crushed doesn’t say it. I am going to take to my bed till.Monday.

              Teaching is a hard and punishing profession, largely undervalued, maybe over holidayed, well you laughed at my best efforts !

              Good teachers have a life long influence on their students. The majority of teachers are good ones and with your passion I bet you are very good.

              I see the trolls are active. I have had a glass of wine (cheap stuff as you would expect of my class and breeding).

              As my old Presbyterian granny used to say ‘don’t post when you are pissed’. I never knew what she meant back in 1970.

              Understandable, I suppose since neither existed.

        • Den

          Ecojon

          I would not dispute your view that the intention was to deflect and disrupt and Carson was successful. I also agree that ignoring trolls is the best way to deal with them. For that reason I did not respond to Carson’s goading or his disgusting post on another forum.

          Although I would have liked him your be ignored other people choose to respond, as they are fully entitled to. In my opinion some of the responses could have been better expressed but my own writing will win no prizes. In the midst of the mayhem some people like Steven, Maggie, Ray and others wrote responses outlining their tolerant and inclusive views. I felt their articulate and dignified responses were worthy of support.

          Whether you have ruffled the feathers of those who responded to Carson’s rant, I don’t know, I responded to their responses. I agree that it is pointless debating with such a closed mind as Carson. Some people felt the desire to do so and acted on it. I support their sentiments and admire their skill in expressing themselves.

          I have in the past been prone to the odd rush of blood to the head but not recently.

          I am not sure that I am proud of saying that Carson was low in a previous correspondence, since that time I have not responded to his goading. I believe that was the the only and therefore most personal attack I have made, unless you include calling a couple of posters trolls in relation to specific behaviour. . I note that they are still up to their nonsense but even so I would not bracket them with Carson.

          I am not sure which debate you refer to but it doesn’t matter as the trolls have disrupted quite a few recently.

          I note that the trolls still target you don’t take the bait and honestly it shows up how empty these people are.

          I find the irrational hatred of religions, races other teams etc very sad but can’t put it into words as well as some of the others on here.

          These are interesting times and I look forward to some interesting discussion to come

          • Den

            Ecojon

            I wrote:

            I note that the trolls still target you don’t take the bait and honestly it shows up how empty these people are.

            Should have been:

            I note that the trolls still target you, you don’t take the bait, and honestly it shows up how empty these people are.

      • Maggie

        @Den
        Hear hear!

  30. RayCharles

    Have just realised that, apart from a few spelling errors and missing words, I have made a bit of a faux pas.

    Given this is a Scots blog I don’t want to upset the sensibilities of monarchists in Scotland by calling the monarch Elizabeth II.

    Elizabeth II is obviously the first Queen of Scots called Elizabeth and as such she is Elizabeth I in Scotland.

    The famous Tudor queen, Elizabeth I, ruled England when Scotland was an independent nation and does not count.

    I’m not saying this is a fact but it is certainly my understanding.

    • Steven brennan

      Ray
      I suppose the English thought all us Scots were terrorists in a way.
      When was that word first introduced? And who was the person/group given the title?

  31. Bet that feels better getting that off your chest eh ? can I take off the tin lid ? I find it hilarious that I have been attacked for slagging off terrorist supporting scum , note, not all Celtic fans , terrorist supporters , but at the same time , reference the picture in the blog, not one person had a pop at the brave soul with the ira flag , maybe if some of you addressed the problem with your own support instead of slagging off other clubs and their supporters you could then take the moral high ground.

    • JohnBhoy

      Good morning carson.

      “… if some of you addressed the problem with your own support instead of slagging off other clubs and their supporters you could then take the moral high ground.” Pot, kettle, black.

      • This is exactly what I was saying ! I pointed to the upstanding citizen with the ira flag and you point to Rangers fans ! never once did I mention catholic schools , not once did I mention Catholics , did I ? show me the post ? I mentioned schools , that could be non denominational or faith schools merely pointing out that his education was lacking , anyone disagree ? I also believe Rangers have problems of the same , BUT , I admit it ! but if you come on here and say something uncomfortable you are labelled bigot , scum , it seems to me that some people just love to be offended .

        • Maggie

          @Carson
          Do NOT pull that one! You are being completely disingenuous.
          Every single person on here knows that you did indeed mean
          Denominational or faith schools.
          It is one of your “peepul’s” rallying cries,so at least have the courage
          of your convictions and stand by your beliefs.

  32. Pingback: “Déjà Vu All Over Again” – Reaction to the SFA Arbitration Panel’s Rejection of Rangers Claim | Random Thoughts Re Scots Law by Paul McConville

  33. cam

    After a relaxing day spent pursuing other interests,photography,architecture and space exploration,i see that a blog descended into mayhem without my assistance.
    If my chums in these other areas of human creativity knew that i spent time mixing with glue sniffing,unwashed,rascist,drug taking,bickering, sweetie wives ,then my position as chair of the Glasgow Bollard Appreciation Society would be under threat.
    I don’t know if its relevant but coming home in the wee sma hours,we drove past Parkhead and spotted two chaps being held aloft by a celebrating crowd.
    If it was indeed Rod McKenzie and the Coyote that were being hoisted skywards, then the Celtic pubs shall be buzzing this weekend.
    Some chiropractors could well be fully booked as well.

    • arb urns

      och an i had u at a party wi donald cam. the dundee streammies were flowin at the fun we had…. ye see when the cams away the bhoys do play…. so yer thinkin its a knack in the kickers frae LNS then.

      • cam

        My tenner would be placed on the result being in favour of the martyrs.This is solely based on the learned opinions spouted in here.
        The greater good must be taken into account and goverment intervention may be required to prevent hordes of enraged craicsters flooding helplines and outbreaks of mass urinating.
        I think the SPL preference would be a financial sanction due to being skint.
        I await the verdict fearing the worst but hoping for the mother of all scuddings.
        The verdict either way has no bearing on the overall moral superiority of the Gers.

  34. Does LNS have a twitch or was he winking ?
    **************************************************

    We also understand that Biggart Baillie, the lawyers representing Rangers oldco, are quietly
    confident of securing a positive outcome.

    They believe the findings of the first-tier tax tribunal – which cleared Rangers of cooking the books – has significantly weakened the case against the club.

    They believe their case is so solid they did not require “star witnesses” including Murray and former director Mike McGill to give evidence.

    • ecojon

      @coatbrigbhoy

      I am reminded of an eminent QC who was more than quietly confident as the jury filed-out. In an aside I said to the court cop that said QC seemed happy with events and I was told: ‘No chance’.

      Many years later I again came across the officer and he explained why he had made his comment and it taught me the value of never counting your chickens in a situation where you have no actual control.

    • Carl31

      That is interesting. Biggart Baillie does represent Oldco, so I wonder how they feel confident?
      Are they in such a mood due to potential penalties shifting via Rangers FC (as described by LNS) on to Newco?

      I wonder how much influence the RFF has on the tack taken by Mr Mure (no not that one, another one) when representing Rangers re any possible sanctions? Was he sent with a remit of avoiding this “stripping of titles”? This could mean the outcome leaning away from this as much as possible but ‘other sanctions’ in their place, should a decision find the Old Rangers were in breach. This could mean that they have a more practical effect on Mr Green’s Blues.

  35. ecojon

    I actually mae a serious error when I stated above that there were no outstanding posts in response to the vile bile of Carson.

    I have now read back and I see there were many outstanding, sensitive and considered posts which anyone other than a sectarian bigot would be prepared to consider.

    Carson and her/his ilk of course have no interest in the truth or reality just their time-warped concept of supremacy which is thankfully disappearing as the mono culture gene-pool constantly fractures and dilutes as everyone else moves on and embraces true multi-culturalism not founded and based on the hate and bigotry of a tiny and disappearing group of people who I don’t consider to aactually be Unionists, like myself,

    Rather they are a schism who view Unionism only through an Orange prism as a means of maintaining dominance and superiority in a tiny part of the UK to the detriment of Catholics. The overwhelming majority of ‘Unionists’ in Mainland Britain – and I am talking outwith party politics here – want every individual to have freeom of opportunity and not to be treated as second-class downtrodden citizens on the basis of their personal religion or even wrongly perceived religious beliefs or lack of them.

    The a thruth about it all is that at the end of the day it has nothing actually to do with religion but, just like British colonialism, is all about money and power for those hiding their identity behind the shiel of the football scarved faces of the disposable foot soldiers 🙂

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