Scottish Football Reconstruction – Quick Analysis from a Man in the Know

Before anyone thinks I am being presumptuous, I am not referring to myself in the heading.

Instead I had an interesting discussion with a senior official at a Scottish club yesterday.

His thoughts on the present reconstruction proposals?

They were unfair and wrong but financially right.

This was not because of how it would affect Rangers (who were never mentioned) but because of the “moving goalposts” idea.

However, as the plan would make the difference between profit and loss for his team, it was a “no-brainer”.

I am sure I could (and possibly will) devote thousands of words to the issue. But here, in a succinct few, the issue was summed up for those who have to deal with it, rather than wax lyrical about it.

All that remains is for me to thank Mr Lawwell for his hospitality and insight.*

Posted by Paul “Scoop” McConville

*Please note that sentence is written in jest. It was NOT Mr Lawwell …

It was Mr Green!**

**No it wasn’t.

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131 Comments

Filed under Football Governance, SFA, SFL, SPL

131 responses to “Scottish Football Reconstruction – Quick Analysis from a Man in the Know

    • Steven brennan

      It was colonel mustard in the changing room with the pen ( which is mightier than the sword)

      • Maggie

        @Steven Brennan
        Afternoon Steven,I see out mutual friend Blue Tit aka
        Goosey Gander conspicuous by his absence over the course
        of the last few blogs….maybe he’s really that big mammy’s boy
        Chris Graham,and he’s been too busy spinning straw into gold
        on whatever heinous site he works for.

        I only ever read anything from these sites if one of you
        Bhoys post a link as I find them beyond horrendous,tho
        like to read Leggo on the days when Chico’s too busy to
        issue the next instalment of his comedy show.

        I feel it’s vital to see who else has been added to “The List”.
        You know “The List” Steven,the one with all the names of
        those to be “dealt” with when the time comes.
        I see that the name of another Daily Record executive
        has been forwarded to Leggo,anonymously of course,for
        addition to the list,and BBC Scotland also making an
        appearance.Pretty much every second person in Scotland
        is on this list Steven,so be careful when you’re out and about,
        in case Leggo or HMBT* Chris Graham catch you wearing a
        green jumper,you’ll be hit listed.

        * His Mammy’s Big Tumpshie.

        • Maggie,

          ” Pretty much every second person in Scotland is on this list ”
          Or pretty much every second a person is added to the list.

          One way or the other, it’s a big list 🙂

        • Steven brennan

          Maggie
          I was working my way down the list of stupid bird names and couldn’t decide on blue tit or blue mockingbird so I was waiting for him to post again.
          Its lost momentum so forever he is the blue tit.
          I spend my days looking over my shoulder( without a banksman Mick )
          And the only list I care about is the never ending one my wife has for wee jobs needing done on the farm.
          Oh dear gave something away there!!!
          Cant go to game tonight as work comes first.
          Xxx

  1. oh no it wasnt!
    it seems to be the pantomine season in scottish football

  2. Craig McKee

    The old double bluff, very shrewd.

  3. was it mr whyte…mr black ???

  4. cam

    Unfair,wrong but financially right,,,yup, that’ll do me.
    Good to see Paul out there bringing the scoops and combatting Commander Leggo who has another scoop on the PR battles being waged in the sinking newspaper industry.
    The Celtic lads have really stolen a march here by controlling many media outlets to present a CFC good,RFC bad image.Quite a few CFC fans are now shaping the way the news is presented.
    During this awful weather it’s very decent of Mr Lawwell* to drive the Harper MacLeod team to the LNS commission and give them an ice hockey coach like pat on the back.

    *No it couldn’t have been,my old eyes were mistaken.

  5. cam

    Mick,this is for you to read when you get home.Have your dinner first!
    http://celticnewco.livejournal.com/2221.html

    • Merciatic

      Presumes an administrative error and not massive cover up of non disclosed payments.

    • Brian J

      @Cam
      Taken at it’s highest value and assuming that what is reported in the article you refer to is all true, it only applies if the LNS tribunal comes to the view that what occurred with Rangers failure to properly register player contracts was an administrative error as opposed to what many would suggest… A deliberate, concerted and prolonged effort to deceive

      • cam

        Hmmm,,it still smacks of CFC ‘s old bangers failure to win the Scottish Rally being explained by RFC’s turbo charged Ferrari’s insurance not being valid.
        Damned incompetence by the SFA can’t be permitted to sully the memories of that beautiful helicopter.

        • Cregganduff

          Cam

          The only Ferrari I can see having any relevance to Rangers, metaphorically or otherwise, would be the doctor of that name who supplied the dope to Lance Armstrong.

          • cam

            I’m getting really sick of these cycling references.Just because we have a bloody bike in the trophy room doesn’t mean you can peddle this nonsense to me.
            You sir, are a tube of the inner circle and in puncturing your metaphor i take great delight in administering a damn good pumping to you.

    • Carl31

      Cam,
      I agree with the thrust of the article linked… that SPLIC “will NOT result in trophies leaving the Ibrox trophy cabinet”.
      I would not want this to happen either, should the findings of the commission go against Rangers. A number of words could be used to describe such a scene or spectacle and none of them are positive.

      The polisher person’s job is safe.

      • Steven brennan

        The polisher, presumably not a holy goaly type pole isher, left on the st ettienne bike under whytes watch.

      • dan

        This is all a matter of semantics. Of course no trophies/titles will leave the cabinet—there’s fuck all in it to ‘leave’! Jesus, wise up!

    • The LNS enquiry, although formed by the SPL, is independent of the SPL so could still recommend title stripping even for ‘admin errors’, it would only be at that stage that the SFA appeal process could take in to account any mysterious UEFA directive.

    • mick

      Ok cam at lunch just now

      • cam

        mick,i’ve just gone and treated myself to another Tesco tenner feast,bottle of vino included.
        You enjoy your lunch mate and i’ll talk complete rubbish to you later.

        • Cregganduff

          Cam

          ” mick,i’ve just gone and treated myself to another Tesco tenner feast”

          Paid for of course by SDM, while the poor Tims had to make do with a fiver’s worth of Irish Stew. Hope his cheque didn’t bounce.

    • Cam,

      I think Mick would easily have this blogger for breakfast.

    • @cam

      “The first evidence of this new directive coming into play was when the FA ripped up their own rule book to allow Bradford back into the FA Cup despite fielding a illegible player in their tie against Brentford ”

      Note the ESPN article says nothing whatsoever about any UEFA directive.

      The appeal was lodged with the governing body, ie the English FA. As for “ripping up their own rule book,” it’s not at all unusual for “guilty parties” to appeal a “sentence” on the grounds of it being excessive (cruel & unusual punishment as they call it in the US,) nor for such appeals to be (occasionally) granted.

      And see all this “administrative/clerical error/technical breach nonsense? Anyone (including Jabba sorry JAMES Traynor) who spouts that should have a wee read of the mechanism for how the EBT scheme actually worked – as I commented in an earlier post, this was not just a case of someone in the payroll department using the wrong chequebook come the end of the month.

  6. cam

    And here’s one for your supper mick!
    http://www.therangersstandard.co.uk/index.php/articles/current-affairs/213-spl-tribunal-good-news-and-more-questions
    I must say that if i was a betting man, then the wonderful PR job carried out by the bloggers has me even more convinced than the FTTT shockeroony ,that a £10 would be best placed on mick’s favoured result.
    I do like an outsider though.
    It does raise an interesting side issue which may sway things.
    Can Scottish society deal with a Gers victory in the LNS fiasco? Do we have the infrastructure to cope with rampaging,pillaging hordes.
    Can the helplines cope? What about the safety of the bloggers who have raised the hopes of the Hoopies.
    The police may have to intervene and persuade everyone concerned that, just like an OF game a draw is the best result.

    • Carl31

      Cam,
      to be fair, the FTTT appeal decision was publicised as a ‘not guilty’, when strictly it wasnt. Maybe something similarly themed will run in most of our countries organs (stop sniggering at the back) despite what the findings state.

      • cam

        The minutiae of the FTTT verdict has been debated by yourself and other learned commentors Carl ,but my simple old noggin will clutch any victory from the jaws of defeat and present it to a starry sky ,Kunta Kinte like.
        Ms Poons ball didn’t cross the line,so if you don’t think its all over then the UTT will say “it is now!”

        • Steven brennan

          Cam
          Just read a great quote in the paper today and immediately thought of you.
          “If the facts dont fit the theory, then change the facts.”
          The author of the quote however does not bear any resemblance to your good self
          Albert Einstein

          • Clarkeng

            @steven
            I am rather surprised you have aimed this at cam.
            I have been saying this is what has been happening for the last few weeks by the great unwashed.

          • cam

            Ah the great man, his most famous work,the General Theory of Relativity can be applied to everything.
            E=mc2,,,E being EBT’s,m being multiple and c being contracts.Forget about the squared element of the equation,that is a Masonic reference which you couldn’t possibly comprehend.
            Multiple contracts bend the space around them like a donner kebab being dropped on your wife’s nightie.
            As confirmed in the FTTT verdict,EBT’s when properly launched are legitimate vehicles for gravitational evasion.
            Any attempt by the LNS field experiment to deny natural laws of quantum physics would result in a temporal displacement and in laymans terms Lord Nimmo and his colleagues would simply cease to exist in this dimension.
            The Gers titles are a cornerstone of our current understanding of the workings of the universe and Harper MacLeods tinkering with these laws is akin to putting a baboon in charge of NASA.
            If you need any help with anything else Steven,including 13 fun things to do with custard ,then let me know

            • Steven brennan

              Cam
              I knew you wouldnt dissapoint me,
              Tu to you

            • Maggie

              @cam
              I’m in awe,great work sir 🙂

            • Steven brennan

              Oh by the way why are you wearing the wifes nightie

            • cam

              Steven,i’m a method poster and my best work is done when i get my working clothes on.
              Being a farmhand you can seperate the cowpats from the gold dust.Try it,dress up in womens clothing ,its liberating..Just don’t go milking the cows in sussies or Paul might have to defend you.

    • Vinnie

      Cam,
      “It does raise an interesting side issue which may sway things.”

      Did you mean a ‘side letter’ or is that another issue ?

      • cam

        The side letters shall become a part of Gers,Tic folklore.I want to see one displayed in the Peoples Palace beside Billy’s banana boots.
        The Gers letters are all perfectly onside due to them not interfering with play.
        They only become “active” when all the fuss has died down.Tiny Wharton would never have allowed any of this nonsense to occur.

  7. JimBhoy

    Admin errors 🙂 🙂 Well i suppose the Scottish footballing authorities have done that in the past also… Mr Farry god rest his soul paid the price however there is another at the SFA who was breaching SFA rules on 2 occasions the latter ’til rangers were liquidated in holding shares (passed to a family member).

    So i guess anything can happen when there are admin errors.

    I go more with Paul’s predictions that this enquiry will run forever and will incur a hefty fine much to the annoyance of Chico who was looking forward to getting off with giving up some silverware….

  8. cam

    The really interesting part of the article,for me at least,is the cost of the LNS commission,the usage of CFC’s lawyers and the very possibly weighted evidence put before the commission.
    Are the Gers a blue coloured Tom Robinson in a green,leafy deep south?
    Can the RFFF find an Atticus?
    Did Boo Radley have a dual contract?

    • Carl31

      …no, because of the considerable amounts of documented prima facie evidence that Rangers may well have did it, whereas any evidence against the fictional Tom was flimsy, slight, based on testimony of untrustworthy witnesses and circumstantial at best.

      • cam

        Aha,,now i have you sir! we never signed Boo Radley due to his failure at not coming out for corners!

        • arb urns

          am not a great fudge man c but somethins tellin me these QC guys willturn out to be ‘queens confectioners’ and produce a tray of the dam stuff. hows about marking the titles and cups concerned with a wee black autographed tennis ball that says these trophies were obtained with the help of a ‘loan scheme’ for some players who assisted in the procurement of said trophies. this loan scheme over a ten year period contained 131 ‘administrative errors’
          and when the ‘loan scheme’ was made illegal the club went bust the following season.

          a fitting epitaph surely or have I misread both you links.

      • Clarkeng

        @Carl31
        Would that be the prima facie evidence which has not yet been tested in court but has been adopted as fact by elements who have already decided that Rangers are guilty and should be consigned to the moon.
        Carl I know this an old chestnut but the principle we live by is the presumption of innocence until proven guilty.
        I am sure LNS will give us a fair trial – he may reach the wrong verdict and the lynch mob may hang us for mass murder et al but I am sure we will get a fair trial.
        Lets all try to play nice until such time as the final verdict is known and then we can have our says.

        • Carl31

          Just mentioning the difference in the case against gers and that against Tom Robinson. Twasn’t my analogy … Go see Cam the Bam.

    • Ernesider

      Cam

      “Are the Gers a blue coloured Tom Robinson in a green,leafy deep south?”

      Count your blessings Cam. What about poor old Orange Tom, whose shade haunts Drumcree Church, forever denied his right to bang his drum down the Garvaghy Road singing The Billy Boys and chanting f**k the Pope. You and I know that no offence was ever meant, just honouring and expressing our ancient culture. And now our flag, that we bravely fought and triumphed for at the Battle of the Diamond and Dollie’s Brae is under threat. This must end now, We Are The People and you torment us at your peril, a day of reckoning is coming.

  9. JimBhoy

    Leggo sending himself some emails again… I hope the polis catch up with him, Like I have said before there is no such thing as anonymous in blogging or email, trust me….

    He is inciting hatred towards the individuals he names. This man is a menace, it does not take much for the eejit fans to take to hatred and violence, there is a history of this and I hope the Daily Record grow a pair and get something done about this bitter old man.

    rangers fans must find this guy a total embarassment. I just find him a danger to society in general, someone sends him an anonymous piece of information (allegedly) and he adds the rest of the story, what’s it gonna take for this guy to be restrained, someone’s livelihood, injuries to them, their families, a life…

    He is a sick, sad individual who is doing no-one any good.

    • Maggie

      @JimBhoy
      What about Jabba being the instigator of the story?
      I didn’t see the column( before Xmas apparently) he wrote for the DR with the accusations against an executive of the paper and his
      editor,though he didn’t name them…….He left that to that upstanding
      civic minded blogger David Leggat. I get the impression that he jumped,before he was pushed from the DR and also Radio Scotland.
      Obviously he and Leggo are BFFs Excellent,they deserve each other.
      As my non Presbyterian granny used to say….. It’s enough to make
      you want to toss your cookies aka gie ye the dry boak. 🙂

  10. portpower

    If only a fine occurs, Que sera, sera.
    I`ll just put Magners on my jelly & icecream and watch Liquidation MkII unfold.

  11. cam

    This whole debacle is interfering with my consumer rights. I now must add the Daily Record to Magners and Harper MacLeod on my banned list.
    If someone uncovers a CFC link to Kellogs then thats my breakfast oot the windae!

  12. Carl31

    Hi Paul,
    “His thoughts on the present reconstruction proposals?

    They were unfair and wrong but financially right.”

    Rangers remaining in the SPL could have been described as this also too. It seems to me that fans voicing their opinion on what this would have did to the sport generally (and it remaining as a sport rather than tending towards WWE type ‘sportertainment’) along with promising not to buy season tickets changed Chairmen’s views on what was financially right too.

    Given that Rangers didn’t get a mention in this case, then maybe ‘the right thing’ for the game in Scotland will seem much less clear, and it may well go through, but its the timing and improper speed of the changes that seem unjust to me.

    • cam

      I don’t usually buy into the conspiracy theories that fly about, but the hand of Mr Lawwell is all over the SPL/LNS commission as is the reconstruction proposals.
      In fairness the guy is fighting his clubs corner, but there’s no need for him to walk around smugly stroking that white cat.

      • Carl31

        Cam,
        thats ridiculous! Super villains don’t walk around stroking a white cat. They sit in a large swivel chair, in a plush office, stroking a cat. Who in their right or wrong mind would walk around stroking a cat? Everyone sits down to stroke.

        Everyone.

        No exceptions.

  13. JimBhoy

    With celtic fans not buying the DR and rangers fans now not buying since jabba left and Lawell took over Scottish media in general, who the f**k is buying that paper?

  14. JimBhoy

    Not sure if the current restructuring is on the fast track, weren’t they talking about restructuring for THIS season to get rangers into an SPL2..?

    It’s ironic that all the bears saying Lawell is behind the restructuring as Celtic will be the club mostly impacted financially. I don’t think Lawell or Celtic or the fans really care too much as you can only play whose put in front of you so numbers don’t matter too much IMO. It can always be changed, fairly quickly apparently.

    • Clarkeng

      @JimBhoy
      Reading todays news it is far from a done deal anyway.
      It seems that some clubs in the SFL are going to vote against it.
      Think clear out at the head of each of the football authorities might go a long way to helping things.

  15. mcfc

    Sitting on my hands waiting to see what will come out of the commission – expecting a QPResque result – ridiculous but not surprising and somehow inevitable. A dull draw with no one happy.

    I’m expecting Lord Nimmo Smith and colleagues to be rigorous, beyond bias and clarity personified – there must be a word for it – oh yeah – judicious.

    I’m expecting the SPL and SFA to be craven and cowardly.

    Why – because handsome is as handsome does. Based on previous attempts to get what they want regardless of the written rules and the will of their paying customers – I expect something along the lines of “long time ago,can’t re-write history, all in the past, let’s more forward, new era, nothing to be gained, good of the game, reconstruction blah, blah, blah”.

    Also, fear is the most powerful emotion – and Green’s little 5-way tantrums have made it clear he has plenty of dirt on SPL/SFL/SFA and is willing to throw it to great effect. Donk and Co are no match for Green in a street fight – and they know it only too well.

    By the way – this reconstruction thing – if you can’t have good, financially stable football with 12-10-10-10 or 12-12-10-10 or 14-14-14 then coming up with some horse-designed-by-a- committee 12-12-18 (aka 8-8-8-18) is not going to make the slightest difference.

    Once again Donk and Co are avoiding the real issues – anyone spotting a pattern here.

  16. rab

    ianagain on Tuesday, January 29, 2013 at 14:24
    Hope they got paid up front.

    Field Fisher Waterhouse corporate finance partner Christine Phillips spent much of 2012 on one of the highest-profile deals of the year, advising Rangers FC.

    Rangers’ assets have now been floated on the AIM-listing and the club has raised £22m to improve its facilities and capital and boost the squad after liquidation saw it go from its premier position among Scottish football clubs to a lowly place in the third division of the Scottish Football League.

    “It was a business that supported a lot of other suppliers,” says Phillips, “so inevitably for any football club to struggle economically in any city it causes problems for a lot of local businesses.

    .“It’s important that you feel you’re doing something constructive for the local economy and with that club it was such a massive brand with a very dedicated and loyal supporter base that it has also been very rewarding to think that you’re helping the survival of the club.”

    The deal was a rewarding but trying one, with the club’s fortunes all the while in the public eye. The consortium led by Charles Green, the club’s former owner, attempted to structure assets as acompany voluntary arrangement to try and ensure the survival of the club and its Scottish premier League membership.

    Key creditor HMRC refused to support this, which meant the construction of a newco and the subsequent vote by the Scottish Football League for Rangers to

    join the third rather than first division.

    Phillips has both secured admission to AIM and an offer to fans to buy shares in their club, the total value of which is now £45.6m. Her work will make her popular with at least half of Glasgow.

    ===========================================

    I dont know if this is badly worded or i am reading it wrong, but the part that says the deal was “lead by charles greens consortium, the clubs former owner”

    is that not textbook pheonix trading and gratuitous alienation. What will BDO have to say about this.

    • rab

      I should have said i lifted the comment from TSFM and i am unable to comment on there.

      • Maggie

        @rab
        “It was a business that supported a lot of suppliers”
        Yeah if support means didn’t pay them……

        • cam

          Michelle Mone isn’t the new SPL sponsor? I know its a diddy league and Lenny can’t handle two cups at the same time, but that would be a major boob by the SPL.
          I’ll try to keep abreast of the situation but work commitments make it hard to juggle with all the new developments.
          This site has its knockers but supporters from all clubs must stay firm and present a united front.

          • Maggie

            @cam
            Dear Oh dear,you’re on fire tonight cam.
            Good job all the bad Bhoys are at the game or
            you’d be getting lambasted.
            You’ve had that one ready and waiting in the wings,
            haven’t you? I’m onto you 🙂

  17. The problem with reconstruction is that we keep doing it and it never seems to work so we have another go. If you look at the top leagues of most of the top countries they have around 18-20 teams playing each other twice and, strangely, they work. Our system of playing each other 4 times weights the league heavily in favour of the best teams and in Scotland that is CFC and was, and might be again, RFC. My own team, Hearts, is capable of beating, say, CFC once in a season. It may take good luck or inspiration, but it does happen. If playing them twice in a season, we would emerge at least equal on points. However, over 4 games a season, luck or inspiration is not good enough and CFC will always emerge with the balance of the points. Extend that to the other ‘contenders’ in the league and the result is that RFC/CFC are almost certain to win the SPL. You only need to look at history. From memory I can recall only one time when RFC/CFC did not finish first and second in the SPL. So, the SPL works against change and competition.

    The ‘original’ 18/19 league structure was thrown out because of too many so called meaningless games. But don’t true supporters go to a game to be entertained. Hearts playing any team, no matter that it is neither a table top decider nor a relegation battle, is worth attending if the game is ‘a bit of a thriller’. If it is played out as a stalemate 0-0 because each team is hoping to be 6th and thus have the chance to play another marginally more financially rewarding game against CFC, then why bother. Neither can win anything, but the fear of finishing 7th takes over. I would far rather take my chances with a match between 9th placed Hearts against, say, 12th placed St. Mirren in a league of 18 where one might see some new young talent rather than some boring ‘meaningful’ encounter between 2 teams hoping to finish 6th and too scared to play new young talent.

    Scottish football has been in decline for years and it is my belief that there is a strong correlation between the advent of league reconstruction and especially the advent of the SPL and that decline. Teams are too scared to bring through youth and prefer to rely on foreign seasoned professionals at the expense of home grown. Look at Hearts (though this season youth is being played force majeure), too many of their stars were over-priced foreigners or seasoned professionals whose best days were behind them. (For slightly different reasons CFC and in the past RFC exercised an almost criminal neglect of their youth systems.)

    If we must have reconstruction then lets get back to 2 leagues of 20 or so. And let’s get rid of systems that are barking mad. But above all play more entertaining football with more youths being given a chance

    • cam

      Violet, that is a great comment.On topic and like an Albertz free kick,on target and unstoppable.

      • Cam

        Thank you kind sir. It’s not every day that you and I attract only TU’s. I am worried.

      • Cam

        What low hound gave you and I a TD? If I find out I will have you add him to your list. Where is Alex – I miss him.

        • cam

          Yes, i noted that heinous act and laughed in admiration at the mentality of the thumber!
          Alex the mighty Kublakhan, has probably succumbed to the onslaught of my big pal mick and my other pal Eco,,,i know he likes me really and he is a guy whose presence makes this site and our little planet a better place due to his good moral code and family values.
          The fact that he is the most annoying bugger i’ve ever encountered is irrelevant.
          Follow Coybigs good advice Violet and keep producing Eco reference free posts and you shall be the pin up girl of this blog.
          Sorry Maggie,but my heart,sword and shield belongs to Violet!

    • COYBIG

      @Violet Carson

      A post in which you don’t mention ecojon? Well done. Seriously tho, good post. It shows what you can conjure up when you forget about trying to wind up a certain someone.

      I agree with your thoughts about teams playing each other 4 times a season. I would also like to see teams only play each other twice a season, but in a 16 team league. The fact of the matter tho, is that clubs need money. The biggest source for money is TV, and TV companies won’t, at this moment in time, pay anywhere near as they’re currently paying for half the amount of ‘big’ games. That’s the crux of the whole arguement.

      I think everyone and their granny wants at least a 16 team league. But equally, I don’t think anyone wants the SPL to be full of players currently playing in SFL Division 3 (no offence to any SFL Division 3 club or player), which is what will happen if over half the money clubs currently get was to disappear.

      • I am cleansed having decided that the poor old boy had been lacerated enough arguing with Vampire Squid – I almost felt sorry for him. Imagine writing ‘Does anyone care about facts on here? You obviously don’t’ to a man who produced only facts and well-researched ones at that. As I said, poor old chap.

        • Cregganduff

          Violet
          The question – ‘‘Does anyone care about facts on here?’
          was originally asked by Vampire Squid. Ecojon who was not having one of his best days yesterday, quoted the question and made a reply to it a few hours later.

          Sorry to be be a wet blanket, but your worthy post on the rejuvenation of Scottish football ignores one simple fundamental point. Scotland is a small country with a small population (5,295,000). There is no point in making comparisons with top leagues in countries with much greater populations. Attendances are dwindling,(the quality of football is mediocre at best), resources and money are in short supply, and that is a trend which is going to continue. Some day they will have to cut their coat according to the available cloth. The big problem is always going to be Celtic and Rangers whose presence make for a highly unbalanced system. Attempting to compete with them has left other clubs on the breadline, while attempting to compete in Europe, – well I don’t have to tell you what damage that can do.

          Scottish football (certainly regarding the many great players it produced) punched well above its weight for many years, as indeed did Northern Ireland, but now its is finding its natural level. Sadly that is not going to be very high, though 72nd in Europe does seem to be a bit low.

          Have I any answers? No not really. Two leagues of twelve at the top level, playing each other 3/4 times? Some sort of non-league system for the remainder. I believe the decline is inevitable and irreversible

    • Pensionerbhoy

      Violet C

      I do hope you appreciate I have left my life support machine to offer this affirmation. I can have no quibble with anything you say here, not that I dare mind you. I have regularly read your posts and carefully avoided your tongue lashings – too old to cope, you see.

      I just wanted to add my bit to what you say. If we, the paying public, the supporters, for whose entertainment the professional game was invented are to receive due reward from any reconstruction, would you not agree that our input, AT ALL LEVELS OF THE SPORT, is quite possibly the most important element? May I ask if you have ever had, but more importantly do have now, the opportunity to put your opinion or ideas to any influential body or individual? I doubt it. So once again, the powers that are destroying this great game will have a free hand to do so over and over (not intended to be a football song reference, I assure you). I firmly believe the time has come for supporters to be seen as well as heard. That, however, will take a united front. Therein may lie our greatest weakness and I think you will agree that our eyes do not have to travel far to recognise the difficulty of our task. Mad! Considering no reasonable person should find fault with your post.

      • I have no ear of anyone. But you have a very valid argument about consulting the people, but they won’t. That said, one would think they would look at what works elsewhere and draw conclusions from that.

    • Clarkeng

      @violet
      Excellent Violet alas I fear we may remain forever a diddy league.
      Too many vested interests.

  18. Pensionerbhoy

    Paul

    Just a quick dip in between sneezes. I see I have missed some atomic bombing over the last few days. Have you finally gone nuclear? Here I was expecting to be tenderly coal fired for the rest of my life and instead I am suddenly blown out of the water by masses of financial fallout. I now know why I love legal in spite of not understanding a word of it. It moves very, very, very slowly allowing thinking time as well as coffee breaks. It takes its time, expectedly, I suppose, given you lawyer fellows are in control.

    I really only came on to do some catch up before replacing the woolly jamies, adding a few more layers of blankets, secreting a few hot water bottles somewhere in between them, emptying gallons of liquid into my system then indulging in some self masochism in an attempt to sweat the evil juices from my delicate body. Before undertaking this cura te ipsum, I simply wanted to say that your source is out. I have it on good authority that you kicked the analysis out of a wee ball boy – lying on the ground too! Not that I would accuse you of being a violent man, physically, at least. To plagiarise one of your writing traits, I am sure it was merely an oversight – or does no one check your methods first? 🙂

    I am off, cough, cough!

  19. John Burns

    The Rangers brand working Overtime to Overthrow the proposal – nothing new there, however consider this – Traynor when at the DR pumped out his pro Rangers blog – the only good thing was that if you ignored the DR then you effectively ignored him.

    Now however, when he publishes his rants, either under the Rangers website, or, Greens name, we get the it in ALL the media in Scotland.

    Consider this, Traynor three times per week in the DR – now 30 times per week on STV and BBC and constant on their websites – once a day on all Scottish newspapers and their Sunday equivalent (exclude Evening Times), that amounts to 34 entries – add-on their respective websites and you will see what I mean – mind-boggling.

    Finally, on another subject – I agree with all Murdo McLeod wrote on Sunday and I find Neil’s comments about him to be snide, unwarranted and unbecoming of a Celtic manager. Yes of course there are those ‘so called’ Celtic-minded pundits who do ‘put the boot in’, most probably because they are in fear of their job – Murdo is NOT one of them.

    Celtic’s recent Hampden displays are wide-open to criticism, the latest, in my opinion, was the most inept and gutless performance that I have ever seen in my forty-odd years of supporting Celtic.

    Let us not be blinded and cowed because we fear that the Sevconians will ‘jump on the bandwagon’ of our justified criticism – forget them, they are where they are and present no challenge to us for at least three years.

    • dan

      Seriously, the way to get at Jabba is not to criticise what he writes, but how he writes it. The guy simply cannot write. He is a megalomaniacal psychopath armed with a laptop. I would argue, and this is saying something, that of all the sports hacks on the go, his is easily the worst prose—and when you think we’re talking Keevins, Jackson etc, that’s saying something.

  20. mick

    http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/the-year-of-the-share-issue/#more-3519

    paul great we bit of waffling bampottery today in cyberspace via the pantomime Principal Boy green he has certianly stole the show to heckles and boos from most of scotland excluding the sevcoians he has cloned from the carcuss of old co he has went quiet lately the feel on this on the online is the asian investors or others have pulled out if the shares were floated to investors is it a pledge or money transfer on day of floatation there must have been a few hicups am put money on him before the summer is out something popping up on him and him changing to the antagonist roll

    • cam

      Very good mick, you kept that thespian theme going nicely.Your theories are truly blockbuster material and i’m guessing you’re a sci-fi fan.Have a look at the Foundation trilogy by Isaac Asimov.
      I’m sure you could draw a few parallels from the books to the Gers saga.Bearing in mind these books and the concept behind it dates from the 50’s, it is still relevant today.
      I shall give you a week to read some of this material and i expect some good work from you.
      Alternatively you could take Descartes statement;Cogito ergo sum,read it via a mirror and disappear!
      Asimov’s 3 laws of robotics and book, I,Robot would provide you with more resources to slaughter the Gers.
      Any man who can create something, Mick, with his brain and his hands,as you do is to be respected and if i annoy you with my wind ups then i offer my hand in friendship and my boot up yer big behind!

  21. mcfc

    What the hell is Longmuir doing giving “exclusive” interviews to Ranger TV – that they are selling at 99p a pop.

    With leaders of such poor judgement and low credibility I regret to say that I think Scottish Football is probably doomed to a long and painful decline. You deserve better.

    http://www.rangers.co.uk/news/headlines/item/3261-longmuir-on-reconstruction

    • Arb urns

      The story so far ,we haveThe president of the sfa who is mired in the SPL commission with his own ebt and a tax avoider ,possibly under appeal ,sitting atop. His underling at the Sfl goes home at night puts on an apron and is bashed about with a rolling pin by his trouser wearing and trfc away strip topped wife and family. And then we have mick gargling title stripper nightly in early celebration and counting down titles and cups.hmm

      That bonkle guy frae Dallas is needed to even things up a bit. No

      • cam

        Rabbie i’m off to the local to sing Killie songs,,,pray for me and the guy whose melon i’m gonna twist!

        • Arb urns

          Suspect it’s maggie yer meetin c furra melon cocktail in a high ball glass

          • Maggie

            @Arb Urns
            Have you not heard Arb,I’ve been thrown over for Violet.
            Oh and btw,I’m no cheap date who drinks melon cocktails,even
            in a high ball glass.I don’t live in Killie after all,that language barrier
            just too insurmountable for me ken ! 🙂

            • Arb urns

              Did c that earlier m, cum is a hairnet man obv. Ally could live in killie loads a pies!!

            • cam

              Fair Maggie, my humblest apologies for your virtue being sullied by my big gob.
              My wrassle with you would only consist of throwing some past participles at you and receiving some irregular verbs in return.
              I prostrate myself before thee.

  22. ecojon

    BIT OF GOOD NEWS FOR PLAYERS UNION

    RANGERS Football Club today received notification of the SFA Arbitration Panel’s decision which ruled that the Club did not inherit the right to continue the arbitration process started by oldco.

    This was always a possible outcome of what was purely a procedural hearing. Suspecting this would be the outcome, the Club had already filed a further Notice to Refer under SFA Article 99. This was done before the end of last year and that process will now continue.

    The Club had argued that since oldco’s registration had been transferred to newco the right to continue the case would also have transferred.

    Nothing has been won or lost at this stage and the Club will continue with its action.

    ———————————————————————————–

    • ecojon

      ON THE RANGERS ARBITRATION ISSUE:

      I think I need do little more than refer to the rather triumphant official Rangers press release issued after the initial meeting of the SFA Arbitration Hearing which all but claimed victory in its tone with Rangers ‘prevailing’.

      https://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/2013/01/16/some-comment-on-rangers-compensation-claim-boost/

      I’m sure everyone will remember chuckles telling Rangers TV: ‘From our side it went as well as we could have expected. From the other side I’m sure they will be disappointed. Clearly they wanted they commission to throw it out and rule that the SFA had no jurisdiction because the whole process of the first meeting was about jurisdiction.

      “What we stated at the meeting was that newco wants to continue where oldco was. We have this slight anomaly where for a period newco were not members of the SFA from June 14 until being granted membership on August 3. It was those technical issues which caused some consternation but I was very encouraged with the meeting.’

      The latest press release also puzzles me by stating the SFA has ruled the ‘club’ cannot continue the arbitration process started by oldco which is now in liquidation. So who can continue the arbitration process – BDO?

      The press release further states: ‘The Club had argued that since oldco’s registration had been transferred to newco the right to continue the case would also have transferred. Nothing has been won or lost at this stage and the Club will continue with its action.’

      But if the club has been ruled out by the SFA has it not at this stage lost? What action does it actually intend to follow and where does a further Notice to Refer under SFA Article 99 lead it?

      One thing for sure is that the Arbitration Committee appears to have agreed with the players’ union that newco couldn’t pick-up the oldco claim. Could be important financially as there was possibly a chance to win tens of million in compo for the players who walked.

      Just a well Rangers is such a cash rich club with money in the bank and a successful share flotation and such a high market cap 🙂

  23. dan

    Did someone I am not allowed to communicate with refer above to the Cartesian ‘Cogito’ and suggest , in a rather juvenile way, that Mick did not cogitate? May I just say that Mick probably ‘thinks’ more than most contributors to this site—-especially more so than his huffy detractor, whose humour is about spontaneous as coastal erosion.

  24. Scottish football doesn’t need reconstruction , just look at the facts , the game is awash with sponsorship offers , Dundee hibs have just announced that the manager will get a massive warchest to win the title , sky is offering a billion pound deal just to show highlights of the teams warming up , septic have just announced that they are going to build a new tier on top of breezeblock boulevard and have rejected multi million pound deal from Barcelona for the tea lady , messi has stated he will only leave Barcelona for septic even if he can’t get into the team because of mo bangura , so don’t fix what isn’t broken , now where’s my methadone ?

  25. cam

    Just had a brainwave!! to prevent mindless trolls disrupting the site and to preserve an area where reasoned debate can take place why doesn’t Paul introduce a scoring system that enables posters to accumulate points to give access to rooms where the big hitters reside.
    I’m absolutely sick of my well constructed arguments being lost amidst a sea of whataboutery.
    I propose a 3 tier system with play offs and relegation.The top commentors go into pots a la the CL group stages and a seeding system could be considered.
    My own preference is a true peoples champions league that could see Mick v Clarkeng,Eco v Violet(grudge match),Alex v everybody, and Carson v Dan.
    I fancy a wrassling match v Maggie.
    Steady JohnBhoy!
    Paul v Leggo in the Ultimate Smackdown.

    • Why do you get the good one ? but I must warn Jan I am an expert in un armed combat , hiiiiiiyaaaaa!

    • mcfc

      cam

      as a diddy commentator I object – just because I can, and my vote is as as big as yours and I’m selfish that way. If you don’t give a flying fig for the greater good (that’s my good) then why should aye – I mean nay

    • Cregganduff

      ‘Paul v Leggo in the Ultimate Smackdown.’
      Over to John McEnroe –
      “YOU CAN’T BE SERIOUS”

      You really are a presumptious little twat. I fear JohnBhoy’s endorsement of your peculiar literary style, has gone to your head. Maggie is at least three levels above you and always will be. A wrassling match with a lady, your vulgarity knows no bounds.

      • ecojon

        @Cregganduff

        I don’t know why he and his ilk don’t just go to their own wee room on the Darkside from whence they come as there is little of interest that they post on here. Everything is about disruption and deflection to hurt the blog and it is so obviously orchestrated.

      • cam

        Good lord i go out for a quiet pint and get accused of all sorts.The big fella that i decided to spar with in the pub wasn’t too enthralled with my appraisal of CFC’s performance.
        After what i assumed to be a CFC goal, the bhoy who looked like the end result of feeding The Hulk, Shergar burgers, mistook my indifference for hostility and suggested that i would be facially improved by involuntary insertion of a beer tumbler.
        Luckily enough i had my season ticket to hand and he equated this as a form of mental illness and let me live.
        Then i return to the ponderosa and note that i’ve been accused of foul play towards the fairest maiden in the east.
        Cregganduff,it was a verbal contest that i was proposing not some CFC initiation ceremony.
        If Maggie was/is offended then of course i shall adopt my best submissive pose and permit her to stiletto me to death.
        You’re the pits sir!

        • Maggie

          @cam
          I can call off Hulk Hogan and send in Noam Chomsky then?
          Past participles indeed,I don’t fight fair,it’s straight to the
          “gerund” for me 🙂
          You must stop mixing the hallucinogenics with the melon cocktails
          tho’

    • Maggie

      @cam
      In fairness I should warn you,I didn’t spend my son’s
      boyhood endlessly watching WWF “wrassling” without picking
      up a few tips,Hulk Hogan is a god to me.
      He’s not THE God,that would be,as everyone knows,
      Henrik Larsson……King of Kings.

    • Steven brennan

      What about Adam?
      Or is he to be the 4th official?

      • Maggie

        @Steven Brennan
        Oh dear God Steven,you could play a 5 setter tennis
        match waiting for Adam to analysis the first rule infringement
        to occur….who has the time? Anyway I intend to send
        Hulk Hogan in my stead,as I’ve just had my nails done and don’t
        want to scuff my new Louboutins 🙂

    • Clarkeng

      Haud the bus cam.
      League reorganisation half way through the season?
      No preferential treatment for me.
      I will be quite happy to play my way up through the divisions.
      And anyway I might not come in to your C League.
      There is always the chance I will take up the offer of that blog in Ingerland.
      So there.

    • portpower

      I`d pay to see that. Admission fee would be an issue though. One side pays full price and the other half. I`ll bring the Magners. One rule of fight club is there is no fight club without tissues. Could you postpone it for a while please because I`m only halfway through my just dessert.
      COYGIG – COYBIG.

  26. ecojon

    Rangers refused permission to transfer player arbitration process

    Rangers newco has been refused permission to continue an arbitration process established by the oldco over players who left Ibrox when the club filed for insolvency.

    The club was informed on Wednesday that it did not inherit the right to continue the arbitration process from the former parent company.

    Rangers have filed a further Notice to Refer under the Scottish Football Association’s article 99.

    See my earlier posts just above.

    • ecojon

      That explains a bit more – obviouly chuckles didn’t buy the rights from D&P or he would be sitting pretty with possibly tens of millions in compensation for the players who walked away.

      It would probably only have cost him a quid the same as the history an it might have been better spending the quid on the players just in case the SPL removes a big chunk of the history. No refund back on your quid btw chuckles 🙂

      • @ecojon

        Having the world’s worst researcher (ie myself) any chance you could give us a brief rundown on article 99? I have the SFA pdf somewhere on this blasted machine, but I’m jiggered if I can find it.

        • ecojon

          @rabthecab

          Only saw your post this morning – tbh getting people lost in rules an regs is always part of PR puffery and I would rather wait and see what the SFA says.

          Basically I can’t see how Rangers can continue if newco can’t proceed with the arbitration action. I have never ever believed that newco could proceed legally anyway. I also thought the ploy of letting oldco Rangers ‘front’ the proceedings, as allowed by D&P, with no financial benefit for oldco creditors was very likely to catch the eye of BDO.

          Of course the Darkside is full of the usual bile and nonsense about Rangers being done-down and stabbed in the back yet again by the SFA who are only out to destroy the red-brick Ibrox facade brick by brick.

          In view of the diet of tripe fed to the fans it’s hard to blame them. If the matter had been explained more transparently then they would most probably have realised there was little hope of success but because of the millions of pounds potentially involved it was worth a gamble.

          Instead they were left thinking it was a fait accompli by the partakers of succulent lamb and that it was highly likely to bring more riches into the already overflowing cash coffers at Ibrox. I hear that Ally’s warchest is already filled to overflowing with transfer cash.

          Of course I know better than to take anonymous sources seriously and will wait to see how much is in the chest if Ally ever gets a key to it 🙂

    • James C

      @ecojon

      I just stumbled on this myself on the BBC website while checking results. Not totally sure quite what this means as the BBC article is pretty thin but what I find most interesting is really the links back to other news site carrying the same story (Herald/Yahoo/Sky).

      they all read as basically a re-print of a rangers press release talking about how they will fight on etc etc.

      the SFA site seems to have nothing at this stage. So we get the response before the result. All a bit strange that this comes out from a parties to an arbitration process rather than the arbitrators themselves. Not exactly “cricket” guys. I woudl have thought an arbitration process would have included some rules about how decisions are published

      Perhaps Rangers are starting to adapt to the digital age more than they are given credit for. One aspect of the internet is indeed lots of bloggers and bampots but another side is mainline media massively downsized and desperate to publish ahead of the crowd. Tomorrow morning is too late now. so no time to check facts or get balance. If a PR group give them ready written stories then it all helps fill up the web site.

      • ecojon

        @James C

        Often arbitration procedures mean that decisions are issued to the parties before they are made public.

        If I remember correctly the media frenzy that preceded the initial meeting of the SFA arbitration committee on 7 January 2012 seemed to be stoked-up from Ibrox. Interestingly the Players’ Union were forced to make public statements because of the grossly distorted MSM reporting which was also littered by serious factual errors. Wonder if they did their own research or relied on an un-named source.

        It therefore comes as no surprise that the Players’ Union has kept its usual dignified silence and not gone rushing to the media on this issue which certainly appears to have fully upheld their legal position.

        Looks to me that the rush to the press by Ibrox is on the old PR maxim that especially with bad news it’s best to get your ‘good news’ spin on it first.

        I’m not so sure in this internet clatterer environment that the neolithic PR tactics are as effective as they once were and they may even end-up looking distinctly dodgy and really pissin-off saddo journos who print PR tripe without doing any research of their own.

        I wa interested in your comment about the adaptation of Rangers and I see the point you are making but what I think you miss is that Rangers fully intend that all club news will come to fans from Ibrox as premium web content or to increasse a clicks. They don’t actually care IMHO about the fate of the MSM whose demise is being accelerate by lazy journos.

        Five minutes of checking by a journo would have revealed the actual truth behind the press release – no journo that I have read, so far, took that step so they sold their readers down the river yet again.

        • James C

          Tribalisation (is that a word :)) of interpretation of events with everyone having their own truth

          I actually find this new media when owned by commercial entities and some characters somewhat scary, old media such as Murdoch was bad but at least somewhat constrained by ‘public opinion’ and if necessary law/government.

          The new media is allowing much more polarisation and frankly extreme propaganda to circulate with the onus onto the individual to separate comment from fact from garbage.

          Apology for the very extreme example but I recall radio Rwanda as well as some extreme websites that allow young Muslims to remain in ghettos of perspective while living in the UK

          I don’t mean to imply that this is where green, Jabba and Leggo are trying to go but by saying only they provide the true watp view then do they open the door

          Ps, on my iPad, watp keeps changing to warp. Made me smile

  27. mick

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21268775

    well done a other victory forevery1 that helped the players green will be raging at dundee lol

    • coatbrigbhoy

      “Rangers have filed a further Notice to Refer under the Scottish Football Association’s article 99. ”

      Article 99 appears to be about eligibility to play in the challenge cup,

      article 12.1 looks more interesting ………..
      Furthermore, all payments, whether made by the club or otherwise, which are to
      be made to a player solely relating to his playing activities must be fully recorded
      within the relevant written agreement with the player prior to submission to this
      Association and/or the recognised football body of which his club is in membership.

  28. Modern technology at the football ! Brilliant ! Each teams statistics , corners , throw ins , possession , passes , shots , fouls , all on the BBC , fantastic in fact they even give you the attendance ……..well at most games .

  29. Arb urns

    Charles green is an anagram of leech rangers. Look up leech in IT terms.clarkeng r u there!!

    Breaking news cum has been rushed to hospital ,after singing his killie rangers folk songs ,with a broken eyelash following a scuffle caused by his out of tune vocals.

    • Clarkeng

      @arb urns
      Just in the door arb and reading through to catch up.
      Been working late.
      Struggling with this one I cant think of any posts on here I would take and re use.
      Have I missed something?

  30. John C

    Restitution of trophies is inevitable, the consequences to the Scottish game and inquiry panels reputation will be devastating if the rewards of cheating are not judiciously dealt with.
    Punishment is a different matter, the obfuscation of the difference, between restitution and punishment is now at its most opaque. Most people don’t know the difference any more, if it was a convicted burglars haul being returned to the owner, everyone knows that’s restitution and fully expect punishment to follow.
    Especially for you pedants
    Lets say the burglars haul was stolen from a museum, the museum don’t actually own a single item in the haul :o)

  31. ecojon

    @John C

    I like your museum analogy.

    I think trophies and titles in a club ‘museum’ could well fall into the same category. They don’t actually ‘belong’ to the club or holding company but to the awarding body who has only given them on loan to the ‘museum’ subject to certain conditions.

    If the conditions are broken then the trophies and titles can be recalled and the awarding body can then do whatever it likes, within its rules, with them.

  32. ecojon

    Just loved this comment on the Arbitration decision from the Darkside 🙂

    ‘Why do we seem to inherit all the bad stuff from oldco, but nothing that might be good?’

    Sounds as though the oldco titles & history are being classed as bad so perhaps stripping them won’t actually affect the fans as much as Rangers International spokespeople have been suggesting.

    Still I think it reinforces my earlier comment about the ‘false reality’ which is continually being force-fed to Bears by the media machine and when their artificially-heightened expectations can’t be met then bile & bitternes sets in big style and this, coupled with a siege mentality, seems to be the direction some people seek to achieve on an almost daily basis for the Ibrox faithful.

    It almost has a Churchilian ring to it: ‘We will fight them on the pitchees from Peterheid to Berwick and we will never ever stop fighting until our final glorious victory when the SFA, SPL, Dundee and Scottish football is vanquished and destroyed with our battle honours intact.

    ‘And then we will march to our promised land far beyond these accursed shores and launch the Rangers League with the founder member’s inalieable right to annual victory and world records in attendance and pie consumption.’

    Set to stirring martial music complete with heavy Wagnerian overtones should set the scene nicely for the final act entitled: Realisation Sinks In 🙂

  33. arb urns

    Why do we seem to inherit all the bad stuff from oldco, but nothing that might be good?’

    cams rice crispies will be jumpin out the bowl at that one.

  34. Carl31

    This is pure guesswork, musings and speculation…

    elsewhere on the web a certain PMcG has alluded to RIFC having not raised what they claim to have raised. Some commentary around this has pointed at the worst case scenario of another fall into admin for the club.

    …precedent says that would mean that instead of winning the SFL3, they would start next season at the bottom. Again.
    But, I guess that it wouldn’t really matter too much since re-organisation would see them at the bottom of the 3rd tier – should that re-org come about for next season. So, no harm done.

  35. lord mac

    if rangers are not striped of titles. ALEX SALMON will never get independence,the SNP would be finished and if judges did cross the divide in there interpretation of cheating, and make it out as something else happend, the SFA will be all but washed up no matter what new formular they bring out

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