Rangers Now, Rangers Then, Rangers Forever – An Alternative View by JohnBhoy

Rangers were founded in 1872 and ceased to exist as a club in 2012. A new club, called The Rangers, was formed in 2012 after the old club was liquidated. Article 12.2 of UEFA Club Licensing and Financial Fair Play Regulations edition 2010 prohibits new clubs from participating in any European competition for a period of three years. As a new club, this ban was automatically applied to The Rangers. Ally McCoist was the last manager of Rangers; sadly for their fans he is the only Rangers manager to lose every competition he entered. Charles Green, the Chief Executive of The Rangers and acting on behalf of the owner(s) of the new club, has retained McCoist’s services for The Rangers.

There is a constant attempt by The Rangers management, and fans of the old Rangers, to deny that The Rangers is a new club, with the obvious purpose of preserving the history and tradition of the old club as one unbroken continuum. The hub of this article is not a counterpoint to those that believe their historical line to be unbroken – the EUFA ban puts that to bed and to think differently is merely delusional – but rather an argument that the history of the old Rangers was based on aggressive anti-Catholicism and does not merit continuation in any shape or form.

From its inception in 1872 to 1989, a period of over 100 years, Rangers refused to sign a high-profile Catholic football player. Rangers’ Protestant Unionist and anti-Catholic background is well documented.

For example: “Historically Rangers have maintained a staunch Protestant and anti-Catholic tradition which includes a ban on signing Catholic players” (Giulanotti, R., 1999: Football: A Sociology of the Global Game).

In 1967, Vice Chairman Matt Taylor was questioned about Rangers’ no Catholics policy and he stated that he felt that the policy was “part of our tradition….we were formed in 1873 as a Protestant boys club. To change now would lose us considerable support.”

The Catholic player they signed in 1989 was Mo Johnston. His agent was Bill McMurdo and he recognised the anti-Catholic history of Rangers: “We were both aware of the history. I’m a Rangers supporter, and so was Maurice’s father, though I suppose his mother supported Celtic. We both understood the situation, the importance of it.”, (The Guardian, “10 July 1989: Rangers Sign a Catholic”, 11th July 2009). That signing caused furore with many Rangers fans: they protested, burnt their scarves and threatened not to renew their season books. Many Celtic fans were similarly upset: not only because Johnston reneged on a promise to sign for Celtic but also because he was a former Celtic hero signing for their greatest rivals, a club with an odious history of anti-Catholicism.

The anti-Catholic stance adopted by Rangers and their fans manifested itself in many ways throughout Rangers’ history. In an article in The Independent, Ian Herbert reports that Sir Alex Ferguson did not enjoy his time at Rangers: “One of the reasons, he has always believed, was the sectarian prejudice of a Rangers PR man… whom he accused of circulating whispers about his wife… being a Catholic.” (The Independent, 14th September 2010: “Why Rangers will Always mean Regret for Ferguson”).

In 1985, the comedian Andy Cameron was shouted down at a Shareholders meeting when he stood up and asked the Chairman to “come out and be honest” about the clubs anti-Catholic unwritten signing policy.

In 1999, Donald Findlay QC was forced to resign his position as Vice Chairman of Rangers after he was captured on camera singing anti-Catholic songs. A typical feature to emerge over the years when Rangers or their fans have been caught bang to rights, is to complain about the conduct of other parties seeking justice. True to form, Findlay, a prominent figure in the legal establishment, complained in his resignation letter about the fact that evidence of his sectarian singing was brought to light: “It is disappointing that someone attending [the function] should have felt it necessary to go to the press”. This is the same Donald Findlay QC who said that the Famine Song was merely an expression of free speech: “There is nothing at all that could in any way be said to be racist or racially motivated about those words.” The Famine Song has been deemed to be racist, resulting in arrest for “racial breach of the peace” for those caught singing it.

In 2009, the official Rangers fan club the Blue Order unfurled a racist banner at an Old Firm game. It was clearly directed at the Irish diaspora in Scotland. It depicted a bus with the words “OFFENDED BUS” printed on the side and a sign pointing to Stranraer. It reflected the sentiments of the Famine Song. The inaction by Rangers FC was loudly berated. Kieran Brady, a leading anti-racist educationist criticised Rangers’ lukewarm response: “The attitude of Rangers as a club and the accompanying rhetoric is in stark contrast to how clubs deal with racism by and large in England…Clubs on the whole condemn the racism almost instantaneously and take steps to ensure the racists are located and consequently prohibited from stadia… there is a futility if there is a lack of preparedness to banish those from the stadium who are incapable of attendance at fixtures without voicing their ingrained prejudices.”

This anti-Catholic stance popularly manifested itself in songs.  The Sash My Father Wore was one such song, celebrating wars against Catholics. The Billy Boys is another. It is a song that was written in honour of Billy Fullerton’s fascist anti-Catholic gang of the 1920s and contains the threatening bigoted lines: “We’re up to our knees in Fenian blood…Surrender or you’ll die”. Donald Findlay liked to sing that song. The famine Song was simply following in the proud tradition of anti-Catholic songs sung down Ibrox way. Rule Britannia is a song that, while not overtly anti-Catholic, celebrates racial supremacy and has been adopted as an Ibrox anthem. Even the Rangers chant “we are the [chosen] peepul” is an expression of superiority over others.

Graham Spiers, in his book Paul le Guen’s Time at Rangers, quotes Walter Smith referring to this superiority complex as religious in origin: “There is a Protestant superiority around this club… you can feel it”.

Any outward sign of Catholicism would meet with disapproval. Artur Boruc, a Celtic goalkeeper, blessed himself before every game. On 25th August 2006 Boruc blessed himself at Ibrox and the Rangers fans reacted furiously. The police reported that it took 10minutes to “restore normality to the crowd”. Boruc was arrested for breach of the peace on the evidence of Police seeing Boruc bless himself and Rangers fans who added for good measure that Boruc also gave them “come on” signals and a “V” sign. The Roman Catholic Church observed that “Scotland seems to have made itself one of the few countries in the world where this simple religious gesture is considered an offence.” In the end, given the condemnation from the Catholic Church, it was generously concluded that blessing oneself was not deemed to be unlawful. I do not recall Gascoigne being arrested for his inflammatory imaginary flute playing, symbolic of sectarian, anti-Catholic, Protestant-supremacist Orange Order bands.

Orange – the colour – is associated in the eyes of Rangers fans with William of Orange, and the protestant war against Catholics, in particular their victory at The Battle of the Boyne. David Murray famously introduced Orange football tops, apparently in recognition of the national colours of their Dutch manager, Dick Advocaat and his Dutch players.  There is another interpretation: irrespective of Murray’s rationale, it nevertheless appealed to those Rangers fans who held traditional protestant and historical anti-Catholic allegiances. Even today, Rangers fans in Northern Ireland have asked Charles Green to produce an Orange strip for the new club. I am not aware that McCoist is Dutch or that there is a preponderance of Dutch players currently on the books at Ibrox. It is odd that Rangers have not produced a St Andrew’s Cross top in recognition of Walter Smith’s successful tenancy as manager. Charles Green was happily photographed wearing an orange top, no doubt in honour of Dick Advocaat and his Dutch signings.

Anti-Catholic sectarian behaviour has led to more than sickness for some victims. In 1995, 16-year old Mark Scott was wearing a Celtic top and walking in Bridgeton Cross. He was on his way home from the Celtic-Partick Thistle game at Celtic Park. For wearing a Celtic top he had his throat slit by a Rangers fan. The anti-sectarian group Nil By Mouth was formed as a result of Mark’s death. In 1996 Celtic launched their Bhoys Against Bigotry campaign even though Celtic had always operated a non-sectarian employment policy and many felt that the bigotry experienced in the West of Scotland was predominately anti-Catholic in nature. Rangers declined to start a parallel project, believing that bigotry could be tackled in a less overt way. It took until 2003 before their initiative Pride Over Prejudice was launched.

Anti-Catholicism is part of Rangers’ history. There will be the predictable response that Rangers have moved on. We sign Catholics.  I will repeat: anti-Catholicism is part of Rangers’ history. You cannot pick and choose what history to preserve. It is there in grainy black and white, and in orange technicolour as well. This article has not focused on other unsavoury aspects of Rangers’ past: the riot in Barcelona in 1972 after winning the European Cup Winners’ Cup, for which they received a one-year ban from European competition; the disgraceful UEFA Cup Final riots in Manchester 2008; the greedy immoral tax-reduction scheme implemented by Murray; the point blank refusal to pay debts owing to the taxman and other creditors in 2011-2012; the outing of panel members dared to impose a transfer ban on The Rangers in 2012; the potential stripping of titles, etc. There is every reason not to rescue the history of Rangers, but the stain of anti-Catholicism is the most damning.

It was the journalist Ian Archer who commented that “This has to be said about Rangers, as a Scottish Football club they are a permanent embarrassment and an occasional disgrace. This country would be a better place if Rangers did not exist.” He got his wish. Archer felt compelled to conclude his column with the following statement: “And, because some people are so sick, I have to put six words at the end of this column. I am not a Roman Catholic.” Their odious history should be allowed to perish with their old club. The new club, The Rangers, should make no effort to resuscitate and preserve that history. A modern, progressive Scotland requires nothing less.

Posted by JohnBhoy

Note by Paul

In fairness to Mr Findlay, I should point out that his robust statements regarding the Famine Song were made in the course of an Appeal to the High Court of Justiciary, where, amongst other arguments, he suggested that the appellant had been engaged in political speech by referring to Fenians, on the basis that he was expressing comment on the secret society of Irish Americans formed in New York in the 1860’s.

The court disagreed with Mr Findlay on that point, as it did with his Famine Song argument. However, it would not necessarily be fair to attribute the views stated by an advocate in court on his client’s behalf and instructions with those of the advocate himself. That, equally is not to say that that is NOT Mr Findlay’s view, but rather that what is said in court does not tell us what he himself thinks.

It would also be appreciated, although I can’t enforce it other than after the fact, if people could refrain from ranting in response to or in support of this piece. JohnBhoy has cited and sourced evidence for his contentions and arguments. It would be appreciated if those engaging with it could do the same.






Filed under Guest Posts, History, Rangers, Uncategorized

364 responses to “Rangers Now, Rangers Then, Rangers Forever – An Alternative View by JohnBhoy

  1. Johnboy

    Now! How can I put this that so that you will start fulminating. This is one of the best posts I have seen on this site and there is not a single word I want to disagree with. RFC’s track record over the years has been a national stain.

    I look forward to you getting back to me with vitriol. But when you do, could you tell me why it is, that someone who could post what you have resorts to the kind of attack you make on me and others.

    That said, surely no club would want to inherit the tradition you post about, but cups and league are a different matter. I am sure Leeds feel they won the league and cup in England and I don’t think too many would grudge them. RFC will always claim the won 500 league titles and every cup competition they ever played in. Let them. As I have said before who cares. But the sectarianism aspect, everyone should care.

    • JohnBhoy

      Violet I apologise for my conduct towards you. Unreservedly. I will now read your post.

      • Maggie

        So glad you’ve made up,I don’t like it when all my pals
        are not playing nice.

        • JohnBhoy

          Hi Maggie,

          Well, it was really for me to apologise. I re-read my recent posts – that Cam is a bloody pain in the arse – and if I had written them to myself then I would have been spoiling for a fight. In a delirious creative rage I did have some beauties up my sleeve, though.They’ll have to wait until the next time I lose control of my faculties.

          • Maggie

            You were def not yourself yesterday,but normal service
            resumed today.You did the right thing.
            I too have felt the delirious creative rage,but now just
            ignore Adam and Alex 🙂
            I’ve got a shameful secret JB,I like cam ( ducks for cover)
            He’s not a bigot and he’s funny,he just loves his club as we do
            ours and does concede ground when he’s out debated.
            He’s our tame bear 🙂

            • JohnBhoy

              Hi Maggie,

              I think I spoke too soon! Cam’s swallowed a brave pill and his Sir Galahad act is causing him to take wee unnecessary potshots, even after my apology etc. I’m obviously not apologising properly but a man has his dignity. Now concentrating all low-level dirty uranium-coated firepower on Cam. Luckily for him my laptop is running out of power. I will attend to him later. Tomorrow is another day!

  2. mick

    For Rangers forums

    CHARLES GREEN, Chief Executive of Rangers, has tonight issued the following statement.

    He said: “Rangers Football Club will not be taking its allocation of tickets for the forthcoming Scottish Cup match against Dundee United at Tannadice.
    “This is a unanimous decision by the board, senior management and staff at Ibrox. Everyone at this club is dismayed at the actions of certain SPL clubs, which were actively engaged in trying to harm Rangers when we were in a perilous situation and we are acutely aware of their attitude to us.
    “Not all clubs who voted against Rangers returning to the SPL fall into that category and indeed we made Motherwell very welcome when we played them at Ibrox in the League Cup competition recently.
    “However, feelings remain very raw and it should be no surprise that we as a club feel this way.
    “It is unsurprising too that there has been a reaction from our supporters to this particular fixture.
    “The last thing we as a club want to do is to compromise security arrangements for any match.
    “I therefore appeal to all fans not to travel to this match and to Dundee United not to sell tickets to Rangers supporters.
    “Our only regret is that this turn of events will not assist Ally McCoist and the team in what will be a very difficult fixture.
    “We should make clear that the Club, the manager and the players all look forward to a situation where Rangers fans attend every match to support the team. The fans are our greatest asset.”

    what a sad day for scottish football this is a other breach of the 5 way agreement there licence should be revoked pronto

    • Mick

      Is this quote really accurate: “We should make clear that the Club, the manager and the players all look forward to a situation where Rangers fans attend every match to support the team. The fans are our greatest asset.” What does he think is going to change. I believe it is reasonable (actually no I don’t, but for the sake of argument) for each RFC fan to make up his own mind and boycott the game. But, as Ecojon says, surely this type of concerted action is bringing the game into disrepute. I cannot see how this is not inflammatory as I will bet money that some RFC fans will buy tickets and might well cause trouble against ‘the enemy’ This takes us way beyond the beautiful game.

      • GWG

        To date I’ve seen nothing coming from the lips of “Mr Charles” that embraces the “SPIRIT OF THE GAME” all I have seen since he parachuted into Glasgow is unwarranted and indeed sometimes offensive statements designed to cause mayhem and to gather in as much monies as he can by demeaning our game with statements like the “Enemy” … “Bigots”… “Thieves” … in the case of Dundee Utd what he has said today is indeed offensive to the supporters of Utd and should be immediately condemned by the football authorities as it is NOT in the best interest of football and indeed NOT in the spirit of the game. It’s football ffs~~~ NOT the beginning of a civil war

    • Maggie

      What!!!!!!!! “certain SPL clubs which were actively engaged in
      trying to harm Rangers” that would be all the clubs who voted
      to APPLY THE RULES already in existence.
      Oh forgot for a minute that rules don’t apply to the “peepul”.
      Does Chico never tire of keeping up the pretence that the fate
      of Rangers is everyone’s fault but their own.
      I initially thought that this P.R. strategy would eventually run out
      of steam because it was SO blatantly stupid,but then again,no
      one ever got rich overestimating the intelligence of the Ibrox

      * apologies to PT Barnum,whose actual words were American

      • Mick

        Hibachi Celtic it’d and Aberdeen and raiith rovers maggie a think they think it’s a timmy thing tripping as usual the lot of them can see the country’s rulers bent of backwards to keep them happy a reckon they know it’d will win as they are well a top uk side

  3. GWG

    Sevco Board REFUSE to take up Dundee Utd ticket allocation ….
    one would wonder what goes through the narrow minds of these peopuil … it may be that they believe that Utd will indeed KEEP the gate money as payment still outstanding from last season’s fiddle that Sevco has STILL NOT PAID!!

  4. Cam

    I fear I may have disappointed you with the above, especially as you were good enough to defend me earlier. As I tried to point out to Johnboy, he seems to fall into the school of ‘if you are not 100% for us, you must be an anti-catholic bigot’. And as for you and I, and others hounding poor Eco. Eco deserves everything he gets with this ‘I am ignoring you’ attitude. Especially when one considers that he could just ignore us without announcing it.

    • Ernesider


      Nice to have you back. I was greatly entertained this morning by thoughts of Cam donning his armour in true Don Quixote tradition and riding into battle to defend the honour of you his Dulcinea del Toboso. I hope Mick is not offended by my proposing him as an ideal Sancho Panza, the down to earth voice of reason who tries to protect the gallant Knight from his worst excesses.

      • Ernesider

        Thank you. I have not really been away though. It’s just that I have other things to do and my time here is limited. Isn’t Dulcinea a dream character – it’s so long since I read the book and, frankly I am not sure I want to repeat the experience – maybe Amazon have a ladybird version. Does this constitute anti-catholic bias – where is Johnboy when you need him?

        • Maggie

          @Violet Carson,
          Think JB was just having an off day.It was “well” out
          of character for him,as mick would say.
          Group hug 🙂

    • JohnBhoy


      The category you assign to me is unfair and quite extreme. If you were to accuse me of writing in an aggressive and ungracious manner, on occasion – but once too often – then you would be on safe ground. To my knowledge I have not encountered any anti-Catholic bigots on this blog and I would certainly not label someone thus for disagreeing with my position. I do not consider you or Cam or Andy, etc., to be anti-Catholic bigots. How you arrive at that conclusion is beyond my powers of comprehension.

    • JohnBhoy

      Violet, are you withdrawing that untrue allusion to how I view others?

  5. Jim Fraser

    Rangers (my team) as a sectarian club is pretty much an unarguable case. Guilty as charged. I hope it changes, but I hear they say society changes at the pace of it’s slowest thinking members, so I’m not holding my breath.
    I’m pretty sure JohnBhoy is misunderstanding the ‘surrender or you’ll die’ stuff, since it would have been the people outside Derry’s walls shouting that (to a defiant No Surrender from those inside). A niggling point, granted given the bigger picture, but it’s better to get these things right.
    I was only wee when we won the Cup Winners Cup in Barcelona, but I’m deluded enough to believe it was a (pretty traditional) end of the game pitch invasion that turned into something else with the reaction of the Spanish police. (When you see how the not-so-long-ago ex-Fascist police treated the McCann family in Portugal, you can see how they might not have taken kindly to the people running on to the pitch). I don’t think you can put it into the same category as the Uefa cup final riot in Manchester, which seems to have been sparked off by a big TV screen failing at a key moment. Unfortunate, but when that happens you’d hope that people would still walk away from (not run towards) the ensuing riot. A disgrace, plain and simple.
    Denying Rangers (or whatever you call us) a history is I think misguided. It may seem like the ultimate ‘bragging right’ but really it’s just deliberately antagonistic. If you justify it because of years of antagonism from the other side, whose level are you dragging yourselves down to?

    • JohnBhoy

      Jim, I accept that the history issue is provocative and could be perceived as antagonistic. It is also a quandary: ditching your history is anathema to the very idea of an institution, particularly a football club, but, at the same time, from another perspective, Rangers’ “proud” history is also anathema to the very idea of equality. Personally I would not justify leaving the history behind for the reason you give. Hope and a better future are greater reasons.

      • Jim Fraser

        Hope and a better future are certainly the reasons we should have volunteered for the 3rd Division, regardless of what other SPL teams decided. Just the right thing to do. Maybe the bigots wouldn’t follow us down there was my hope. Naive, no doubt. Certainly our history off the field isn’t a proud one, but trying to eradicate us as if we had no history at all is just a bit vindictive, don’t you think. (Many posters on your blog would clearly think not).

    • Jim,

      You have a lot of content but unfortunately not the facts to guide it.

      The Rangers fans were aggressive in Barcelona, before, during & after the game, the Spanish police reacted to the Rangers fans not the other way around.( What that has to do with a child’s abduction in another country & their police Forces reaction to the child’s parents. is beyond me.)

      As for a big screen failure causing the Manchester riot, that is complete & utter rubbish, go look at the footage. In reality there could have been fatalities, including that Policeman. It was a drunken rabble with superiority issues on the rampage. .

      I watched the news tonight & saw a similar rabble , react in a similar way,in Ulster, many wore Rangers clothing. The guy they interviewed sums it up, ” They have taken away our bonfires, parades & let power sharing, now they have taken away our flag”.

      Bombastic, we are the people attitude, & funnily enough it is actually Not their flag. I am not saying that all the rioters were Rangers fans but I am highlighting the attitude as being the same.

      It is not antagonistic to stand up to this type of crap, nor is it antagonistic to stand up to the ongoing bull from the Sevco Management team & supporters.

      If the truth is told, & it should be, the SFA/SPL/SFL have created a monster. By bending, breaking & ignoring the rules to ensure that Sevco were given a place in the 3rd division & holding five way meetings to negotiate which rules Sevco are Willing to obey, the we are the people attitude has been given credence.

      Now Green does what he wants, their fans threaten who they want & McCoist seems to be above the rules applied to other managers & the SFA, because of their compromised position seem incapable of doing anything about it.

      The Sevco situation is festering on & if the SFA do not tackle Green over the Dundee United situation they may as well resign., they are not fit for purpose..

      As for the issue of history., Sevco have none. The Rangers supporters have their memories, which is a different thing.

      This is not about bragging rights ,it is about the fair application of the rules & the compliance of members of the association to those rules.

      Sevco aka The Rangers are not above the rules, or at least. they should NOT be.


      • Jim Fraser

        I’m sure you’re probably right about the Manchester disgrace, Ian. (I thought I was as clear as I could be that I thought it was a disgrace.) I mentioned the big screen thing only because a Celtic fan I met the other night was in Manchester that night and told me he thought that was the catalyst to events. No doubt he could be wrong. My point was that, regardless of what might have ostensibly ‘sparked things off’, rioting is just unacceptable – you run away from one, not towards one if you are a decent human being. Hope that has cleared that up.

        My reference to the Portugese police was only that it struck me both they and the Spanish police were for a long time under fascist governments and so had, it seemed to me, possibly developed some bad habits like striking people with riot-sticks without much regard to their democratic rights. I wasn’t trying to make a big defence case out of it, since as I said I wasn’t there. I had, however, taken part in a few end of game pitch invasion when I was a wee boy (it was the 70s) more often than not with St. Johnstone fans at Muirton Park. No doubt the Spanish police were unused to such antics, and may have reacted. I childishly cling to the fact that this is at least a possibility. (Had I been there I would quite probably have invaded the pitch myself. I know, it’s shocking, isn’t it.)

        As to Rangers fans being aggressive before the match – well, it’s entirely possible isn’t it. Sadly, it would fit the pattern. I’m sure you wouldn’t say it was so without having any evidence.

        As to current events, any sensible person would be incensed to see A. McCoist demanding to be told who was on the disciplinary panel (when he already knew, or could easily have found out). And the actions of Charles Green are also highly questionable (e.g. Bigot-gate; and boycotting Dundee United). No doubt all calculated to curry favour with the worst elements of our ‘support’.

        So there’s little light at the end of the tunnel.

        No, wait, there is!

        My new Celtic supporting friend said he was missing the prospect of an Old Firm match any time soon (not the party line just now, I appreciate, there being lots of jelly and ice cream still left).

        Still, we live in interesting times when Celtic fans begin to miss us, for any reason.


        • Marching on Together

          I have no knowledge about what happened or caused it in Barcelona in 1972.

          However I was in Malaga with Leeds for a UEFA Cup game in 2003. We had been in Valencia for CL semi-final two years previously with absolutely no problems (apart from the bizarre Spanish rule that it is acceptable for you to punch the ball into the net), yet the Malaga papers had been full the whole week leading up to the game of how the Leeds hooligans were coming to town and were going to smash the place up. There were no problems before the game – a bit of of drunkenness, but no more than you would see in Malaga during the summer, yet the riot police were all there at the stadium. There were no problems during the game, which we lost, and after the game it was announced that we would be kept in until the home fans had dispersed (fair enough, and something we were used to). We amused ourselves by singing songs at each other (the Leeds fans were split between two separate wings), but after half an hour of this (bear in mind that the match had finished after midnight local time), we were no closer to being let out, and there was no information being given to us.

          Some Leeds fans politely asked the riot police when we were getting out, to be met with batons drawn and angry gestures forcing them back. Some reacted angrily to that and remonstrated, at which point the police started laying into those that were remonstrating, hammering them with batons. The Leeds fans either scattered, or charged the police aggressors, and the entire riot police contingent waded into all the Leeds fans within reach, no matter what they had been doing.

          There was no concept of reasonable force, no concept of distinguishing between those fighting back and those trying to flee the violence. This was violent GBH on a massive scale. My mate next to me had an overnight stay in hospital due to the battering he took, and no he was not in any way an aggressor. I was taking photos of what was happening, so that made me a target, and only being nippy and ducking out of the way, stopped me assaulted.

          That night the police were unrestrained aggressors, and while I know that at times some of my fellow Leeds fans have deserved it elsewhere in Europe, that was most definitely not the case here. Needless to say, none of this made the papers in the UK.

          When Rangers were in Osasuna a few years later, the tales they told seemed extraordinarily similar to the experience of Leeds fans that night in Malaga, to the extent that they rang true. I also seem to recall that the son of a Celtic director suffered a beating at the hands of Spanish police while following Celtic as well.

          If anyone ever tells me of football violence in Spain involving British fans, my experiences have taught me that the probability is that the Spanish police caused the problems.

  6. ecojon

    Well it increasingly looks as though Chico’s share flotation might rest on big Bear participation which means they have to be kept sweet at all costs. Having tasted this amount of power it will be interesting to see what their next demand is.

    Raises interesting points though in the sense of is there any need to buy shares by fans if they can control major club decisions without them? I recon chico was partly bounced into his decision by the HMRC appeal announcement which must have hit Rangers hard today.

    One can only speculate how institutional investors feel about investing in a club which throws away money ny refusing to move to the top league and is now refusing to sell tickets and losing its gate share. Obviously Rangers should be entitled to nothing from the sale of Dundee United fan tickets.

    Also, how can this financial threat against SPL clubs chosen to be ‘enemies’ by Rangers be ignored by the SFA. And what about the SFL have they nothing to say to one of their member clubs or is the lure of the Blue Pound proving irresistable to them.

    Lots of serious issues involved and I have the feeling that it might not all turn-out as well for Rangers as chico and the fans appear to believe. There will be a reaction from the authorities as to ignore what is happening could well lead to anarchy.

    When the dust settles after every Scottish Club is destroyed who will Rangers then play? That’s why I reckon the SPL and certainly some SFL clubs may well decide it’s better to hang together than separately.

  7. cam

    Not at all Violet,Johnbhoys blog was accurate in most aspects of Rangers signing policy and you have, by your polite response shown yourself to be a bigger character than he.
    The guy just has to put his mitts up, apologise for his tantrum and get back to where i laugh with him and not at him.
    Eco’s attempts at the banter,should convince him to stick with Google.
    He can’t be a fox and run with the hounds.
    I’ve gotta go to work and try to dodge the Gers hordes picketing everything,the smell of violence is in the air,,,sad old buffer.

    • JohnBhoy

      Cam, I am trying to be good but your personal comments are making me think twice. To hell with it, the boxing gloves are back on. In future, when acting as peacemaker, which I respectfully observed and proffered an apology as requested, do not labour your points and make continued personal attacks on one party: it only inflames a delicate situation. Look forward to reaching down to your level. Catch you later.

      • cam

        Johnbhoy if you look at the timings of my posts you will see that my last mince delivery was before your gentlemanly truce with Violet.
        The format of the blog can mislead.
        Fair play to you and if you want to blast away at me then thats cool,i like your funnies and can handle anyones tirades.
        I think we should treat this place as a pub and behave as if we’re having a works night oot.

  8. ecojon


    Can Dundee Utd concede home draw advantage with game moved to Ibrox?

    Will the Bears then boycott Ibrox because Dundee Utd would make more there from the gate than at home?

    All interesting stuff with a long way to run methinks 🙂

    • mick

      @ecojon what a have noticed is they dont mention negitives like ftt and the utd fiasco just stright in slagging commentors

      • ecojon

        @ mick

        It’s the Blue Reality – catch it and next shamble you’re a Zombie 🙂

        I seriously believe they’ve let the genie out of the bottle with the Dundee Utd issue and who knows where it will lead.

        And it’s hard to overestimate the damage to Rangers from the HMRC decision. It almost looks as though Hector was waiting for Ogilvie to say that he was staying at the SFA because everything in his EBT garden was smelling of roses. Then along comes the manure truck 🙂

        • mick

          @ecojon yes what a tianted bunch of cheats CO must be wondering whats in store early next year when his contract is up

          • Maggie

            @mick & ecojon,
            I’ve always felt that give Chico enough rope etc.
            The SFA should have reined him in earlier when he
            first started spouting his “bigoterie” crap and his clapping
            and singing along with the moronic Ibrox hordes.
            Now that they’ve got their persecution complex turned up
            to full blast,anything the SFA does to sanction them will
            result in,well who knows,I shudder to think.
            Of course any judgement against them will be seen through
            that prism of “those who wish to damage our club”
            ……that would be you Chico,you buffoon…..
            Had a good laugh today while reading of Campbell
            Ogylvie’s intention to stand again as President of the
            SFA. Good luck with that one Campbell.

            Btw. Wonder what all those blue chip investors Chico has
            lined up think of his latest wheeze ?

            • mick

              hi maggie dont forget he might be lying about ticketus so his bubble might burst soon tomorrow even when bdo say whos creditors and debtors there could be a boycott of ibrokes till he gos if trus lol its hotting up for a wild winter am thinking

            • ecojon

              @ Maggie

              I have got to say that I am totally flummoxed by chico – it seems like one of these waking nightmare films being played on a continuous loop.

              I genuinely cannot believe it’s structured and the alternative is its either a spinning top about to wind-down or a volcano ready to blow.

              And all the time I think if I was an institutional invesors and looked at this – forgetting that would never happen anyway because it’s a football flotation – I would be saying he won’t play in the top league which is the only one that makes any money and now he’s boycotting cup game money.

              I would be changing my mobile number to make sure chico could never contact me again.

              And in reality how much spare cash can the Bears stump-up with Xmas getting so close and then you know what Jan/Feb is like especially if you have kids with all the Xmas spending and the gas and leccie bills coming in.

              It just seems like certain disaster but can it really be as bad as it looks – that’s why I keep thinking there’s a possible financial escape route. But maybe not, as I’ve dealt with driven people before and you don’t know they’re going to jump till you hear the splat.

              But, seriously, Scottish Football is finished if they don’t do something right NOW and it has to be brutal – it’s the only way it will get through. I reckon he should be declared not fit and proper and the current owners of Rangers – whoever they are – will remove him. There is a very interesting episode at Sheffield which has strange echoes of Ibrox.

              However, the sooner this phase pases the sooner someone with an actual long-term vision for Rangers, which does not include world domination, can start rebuilding the club and the first priority is the support IMHO.

              It is intolerable that any one support can openly plan to financially destroy Scottish Football – it just can’t be allowed and Dundee Utd and any team which they attempt to pick-off must be supported by the fans of every other club because we don’t know who will be next now that the blood-lust has been loosed.

              OK rant over – just for now right enough!

  9. cam

    Eco’s done it again!
    “HMRC’s decision to try to appeal the FTT verdict must hurt Rangers!”

    We have just had days,weeks,months of the loons telling me that the Gers are no more and then off he goes and opens his mouth!

    • Felpan

      Which Rangers are you talking about? Rangers the club that run into millions of dept, went into administration and is now in liquidation! Or The Rangers that claim to be the same club that is in liquidation, But say they don’t have any dept!

      • ecojon

        @ Felpan

        The guy’s a clown. I did a serious post and raised a number of issues which he obviously has no answer to so he comes out with an inane comment. It’s par for the course with him.

        And btw not only does it not have any debt but it’s still got the ST money under chico’s mattress – You just couldn’t make it up 🙂

        • mick

          hi eco theres a new saying going around lets not massage the ego of trolls am sticking to it and a would appeal to all celtic minded commentors to do the same as pauls blog is desending in to a what about you via alex cam adam and a few others who cant control there mindset

          • Felpan

            @ Mick 1000% agree, I always enjoyed reading the replies and the adult debate on here almost as much as the blog itˈself, But these (Pointless Existence In Blissful Ignorance ghosts ) seem to enjoy trolling through every post on every blog looking for a reaction.
            @ ecojon you call him a clown! Do you not think that’s a little bit harsh on clowns!

            • ecojon

              @ Felpan

              It would be if he was a happy clown but he’s a saddo clown so it’s OK IMHO 🙂

              Yea, time to really ignore them – their problem is they hate their own sites because they think they are a cut-above your average Bear – but scratch them and the bile’s just the same.

              And their PR bonus will be cut to ribbons – They get a 1o% salary cut when I put them on the ignore list but a tenner for every post of their’s I answer,

              So it’s going to be a tight Xmas for them and can you imagine being sent to FF or RM to try and keep their punters from getting jailed for their comments. They like their billet here but it’s time to end it 🙂

          • ecojon

            @ mick

            Oh dear is it not bad to ignore idiots – I have heard whispers that I am a bad bhoy for ignoring them.

            But you’re quite right as usual. Unless their post is on topic and sensible they’re on the ignore list.

            They are just too easy to rip the p*ss out of and no fun any more.

            No massage for Trolls is our Battle Cry!

          • Maggie

            I’ve been doing that for weeks,I make an exception for cam as
            he’s a regular and is reasonable and funny.
            Off topic mick,I’m watching Heston Blumenthal on Ch 4 while typing.
            He’s in a pie factory in Yorkshire where the owner has made
            15 million pies…….that just the last order from Ibrox….Boom

          • Den

            Good call.

            Some people were doing a good job of dragging the blog down towards the gutter.

            Unfortunately arguing with and insulting the trolls only encourages them. If you see the obvious bait being put out just move on.

            I find imagining some inadequate locked in his room spewing his bile on the Internet stops me reacting in anger. Negative attention is better than none for these souls. It really is quite sad,

            I am looking forward to the HMRC appeal. I am still making my way through the FTTT decision, it is long and I am not that fast in the uptake. Good read though once you get used to the jargon.

            • ecojon

              @ Den

              I find that every time I read the FTTTT deciion a wee bit more becomes clear and I see thing that I didn’t before. Quite fascinating really and good exercise for the brain 🙂

    • Cam, The FTT Appeal concerns MIH & RFC(IL), it has NOTHING to do with Sevco aka THE Rangers, except in a possible toxic fallout way because of the claim to be the same entity.

      It takes away the rubbishy Traynor type argument that RFC(IL) “won” the FTT so any SPL Tribunal should be abandoned. Now the SPL thing may have a big knock on effect for Sevco as they have agreed to any penalties applied.because of it, should they lose it of course.

      This does not only mean possible loss of titles & trophies, there are a variety of sanctions which could be applied, including financial ones.

      I think the crossover of sanctions from RFC(IL) & the appeal make Eco more confident that it will stick & if it does it will hurt “Rangers” in whichever guise & must be a serious concern for Green in the lead up to the Share issue.

  10. Adam

    So, are any of the big hitters going to take on Easy Jambos take on “then,now and forever” ?

    There is a precedent in Scotland of a club folding and being reformed two years later, complete with their previous history. The club? Hibernian FC.

    Hibs folded in February 1891, didn’t compete in the league in season’s 1891/92 and 1892/93. A newco entered the newly formed 2nd division of the Scottish League in 1893/94, which they won. They assumed the history of the oldco, including their cup win of 1887.

    Here is an extract from a Scotsman article of 22nd October 1892
    ‘RESUSCITATION OF THE HIBERNIAN CLUB. A meeting to consider the advisableness of resuscitating the Hibernian Football Club was held last night in St. Mary’s Street Upper Hall. There was a crowded attendance and Mr. C. Sandilands was called to the chair. In his opening remarks, the CHAIRMAN said the gentlemen interested in the promotion of the club wished it to be distinctly understood that it would be promoted on somewhat different lines from the old club. They desired it should be non-sectarian. They desired also to keep clear of the old committee and up to the present time had had nothing to do with them. He then proceeded to give a statement of what they had already done towards reviving the club, mentioning that the promoters had their eye on a field which they had hopes of securing. Up to that time they had guarantees of £115 which however as
    nothing like sufficient to start the club. He intimated that they desired to open with a first class team and a first class ground. He concluded by inviting
    suggestions; and after several questions had been put and answered, MR.
    FLOOD moved a resolution declaring that the formation of the Hibernian Football Club had now become an urgent necessity, and empowering those willing to join to proceed to make any preliminary arrangements they might think fit. This was seconded by Mr. Mitchell and unanimously adopted. On the motion of Mr. Galwin it was agreed to accept five shillings from anyone
    present towards the guarantee fund, that sum afterwards to go towards their first membership ticket. The CHAIRMAN intimated before the meeting ended that the guarantee fund had risen to £130 and names were then taken of persons desirous of guaranteeing with a view to membership, a good number going forward.’

  11. mick

    dont massage the egos of trolls is the matt and tommy media message spoken tonight via GRO brought to us by tommy platinum gold

    • ecojon

      @ mick

      Amazing isn’t it. On a day when HMRC appeal a decision that had the Bears dancing on the rooftops a couple of weeks ago – we get silence.

      The Dundee United situation has their supporters threatening to spill their own blood over the picket line threat and the abuse levels they are hurling at each other is fascinating.

      And Ofcom has thrown out the Ally suicide complaint – not a cheap on that.

      And their HMRC petition seems to be losing its legs and is about to actually slide backwards and that’s before all the cheated signatures are removed and the petition may actually be scrapped depending on the level of cheating discovered by the audit taking place by the Commons IT department.

      And what do they want to talk about – something that happened involving another club in 1887 and I stress it appears that it was a club and not a Ltd company or Plc and is therefore totally irrelevant to the current dicussion – There is no Rangers ‘club’ with a legal persona unlike the Hibs club.

      Alex, a per his usual practice never tells the whole story, and forgets to mention that Hibs had become homeless in 1891 and it took them until late 1892 before they managed to lease the ground at Easter Road where they played their first game in February 1893.

      What amazes me is that alex seems to think the continuity claim is some kind of secret – I have known about this for over 40 years and I’m sure any Celt with an interest in the Irish influence in Scottish football would have been well aware of it.

      But it’s an apples and pears comparison for the reasons I mentioned because Rangers don’t have a club – but alex and adam if you want to believe differently please carry-on but question each other on it because it has no relevance to the various current and ever-expanding Rangers emanations.

      • Well, I’d have to confess that I hadn’t heard about the Hibs story until tonight. Whilst I’d tend to agree that it probably doesn’t directly assist us much in considering the RFC position, your comments do help illustrate a point.

        You are wrong to state that the unincorporated Hibs club had a legal persona. An unincorporated association – such as a club – has no legal persona in Scots Law, and can only contract through its individual members acting as agents for the greater group of individuals which form the membership of the club.

        I think that was broadly the concept of “club” as a legal entity with no legal personality which Lord Nimmo-Smith was trying to convey in his analysis of the SPL rules contained in paragraph 46 of the commission’s reasons of 12th September.

        If a club has no legal persona pre incorporation, why is assumed it acquires one after incorporation? When the club’s members form an incorporated body, that club then contracts through the agency of that incorporated body – i.e. the club still has no distinct legal persona of its own, but now operates through a legal person rather than through a group of natural persons.

        Again, that seems consistent with Lord Nimmo-Smith’s interpretation of the position of “the club” under the SPL rules, and is also consistent with the argument which has been presented on here previously that “the club” is analogous to “the undertaking” or “the business” which may be transferred between corporate entities (whether the transferor is solvent or not) in a normal business context.

  12. charliedon

    I simply cannot believe Charlie Green has announced his club will not be accepting tickets for the Dundee Utd game. His club has entered the competition but is now not fully participating in it for the purpose of adversely affecting another participating club.
    To my mind the SFA has to step in and boot them out of the competition. I think Mr Green has way overstepped the mark this time. His actions are stirring up bad feeling and are totally irresponsible. The SFA must surely now take the stance that he is not a responsible person to be running a football club.

    • lordmac

      yes i believe the SFA should take action fine them for the expected loss of ticket sale and base it on the highest attendance that rangers have been to there park as a starter, the SFA run this show so let see action from Doncaster.

    • ecojon

      @ charliedon

      Well it really is of the SFA’s own doing and their protege is paying them back big-style. I totally agree with you and it seems such a crazy act by chico that he has either lost the plot or needs someone to blame for a disaster heading for Ibrox.

      With mystery foreign investors with money in anonymous offshore trusts and the like how do you know who you are really dealing with – maybe one of the investors is p*ssed off and looking for their pound of flesh.

      If the SFA dodn’t act then there could well be anarchy and what will be the next demand of the Rangers hordes?

  13. Charlie has seriously rattled a few cages here, the angst ridden are panic stricken at the no nonsense no prisoners approach of The Rangers top man, ra selik never defeated always cheated since 1888……54 and counting..

    • lordmac


    • charliedon

      Your team is fortunate to have been granted a licence and allowed to play senior football at all in Scotland this season. To now behave in this childish, vindictive manner is quite irresponsible, disrespectful and pathetic. The sole intention is to harm another member club and this is not acceptable in a sporting competition. If Green carries through this threat your team should be booted out. Simple.

    • ecojon

      @ alex

      Best thing he ever did – as he will have to be dealt with – it will be a BIG mistake.

    • Felpan

      ra selik never defeated always cheated since 1888……54 and counting..
      And there you go, They just can’t help themselves! When ever a question is asked about Newco Sevco The Rangco or what ever they like to call themselves these days they revert back to the but but but but Celtic Celtic Celtic…..

  14. Ernesider

    Some Philistine has had the audacity to give you thumbs down. I have given you one to balance things. Total lack of chivalry about here this last while, have you noticed.

    Now that is enough nonsense for one day. A pint of Magner’s Cider awaits.

  15. charliedon

    My first reaction was that Chico was just once again jumping on the fans’ bandwagon and playing up to the hordes with his share issue in mind. However this brazen statement is crazy even by his standards and I suspect you may be right – all may not be well on the financial horizon and this could be his opening salvo in his exit strategy.
    By the way, what has happened to the share prospectus?

    • ecojon

      @ charliedon

      That’s a good one – I think by now they realise how many Celtic pledges they have, Institutions would need to be mad and I just don’t see it. I also can’t see all of his original investors staying.

      So I think he’s into a series of meeting each with 2/3 possible investors to get a million here and a half million there. But with all the negative PR surrounding the club and continuing uncertainty I have serious doubts he can raise enough that way.

      I really think he’s too late to get any real money from the Bears before Xmas and January/February are badly affected by the Xmas extra spending hangover.

      But he’s a survivor and a class act salesman so I don’t write him off easily but this Dundee Utd thing is just playing with fire and even the SFA has got to do something. Can you imagine what the SPL and quite a few SFL clubs will be saying to them.

      It’s a bubbling cauldron and wouldn’t take much I reckon to spill over.

  16. lordmac

    who was it that said good news comes in threes first they remove the union jack from Belfast, then Hmrc appeal, then royals are allowed to marry catholics and be kings or queens, they where spot on with there analysis.

  17. What sort of rhabid fans boycott their own team at their ground any guesses….. that’s right The Groin Brigade Boycott….

    People who live in glass houses should shit in the dark,….lol

  18. nickmcguinness

    If there had been really any half-sensible corporate investors taking an interest in the RIFC PLC IPO they would have taken one look at Green’s bitter, illogical rant from today and concluded that his oafish boasts about the greats of England and Europe queueing up to welcome his outfit to football’s big table were no more than the empty whimsy of a semi-comical blowhard.
    Green is a nasty and deluded fool who is stirring up a whole horde of nasty and deluded fools. And making enemies and burning bridges along the way.
    The SFA should hammer him and The Rangers. Hammer them hard.
    The sad thing is, though, that Scottish football would benefit from having a decent RFC that was professionally run at corporate level and strove to demand the highest standards of social responsibility from itself and its customers.
    However, that is not the bile-filled and vindictive Sevconian disgrace that we are at present having to suffer.
    It’s sad, really. No, honestly, it is. Very sad.

    • ecojon

      @ nickmcguinness

      I have always argued the case on here for a strong Rangers being good for Scottish football and I really believed the drop to SFL3 and the climb-back would allow decent Bears to take-back their club. Hasn’t happened and the SFA, MSM and chico are equally to blame for it IMHO.

      Just makes the whole process harder and longer.

  19. lordmac

    the easiest way to settle this game is, for the sfa to reschedule this game and make rangers have a long week off again, with no income.and
    subsidised Dundee for there loss i think they would soon fall in line as the club will not be bought on the cheap again.

    • ecojon

      @ lordmac

      Yea that’s a possibility. Tweeted one of my mates earlier and he was up for going to the February match so we would take a car load up.

      But there could be a security prob I reckon with non Dundee Utd fans as far as the cops are concerned and it’s understandable so if the worst comes to the worst I’ll just send ticket money direct to Dundee Utd.

      I think a lot of ordinary supporters will do the same – we just can’t allow a club no matter who it is to be picked-off like this by bullying tactics.

  20. mick

    the whole of scotland is laughing at them agian they just cant help themselfs they should just revoke there licence and thats that

  21. For the angst ridden, do enjoy.

    Rule 41 states: “the visiting club shall have the right to claim admissions up to 20% of the spectator capacity of the ground”

    • redetin

      “the right to claim admissions up to 20% ” Of course, no one is suggesting they can’t submit their claim. Will they really do so? Will they expect their claim to he honoured without question? Green will never submit such a claim and the club would not accept gate money from Dundee Utd.

      • mick

        redetin dont let alex put you of postting here you have a balanced view and contribute well and 1 am 1 of many who reeads your comments on here and over at tsfm as you are aware hes the site black sheep

    • Felpan

      47. Alterations and Additions to Rules
      (a) The Board shall have the power to temporarily suspend, amend or add to these
      Rules as circumstances may dictate from time to time, as it deems appropriate in its reasonable discretion, to facilitate the smooth running of the Competition, or in order to ensure that the Association is capable of meeting the commitments put upon it under the terms of its television and sponsorship contracts.


    • Marching on Together

      That rule was brought in after David Murray refused to allow Celtic fans entry to Ibrox (I think in 1994) claiming that seats had been trashed at the previous game and claiming (wrongly) that Celtic would not pay the bill. At that point he could do that, but after that one example he could not.

      Not aware of any rule which says that away clubs have to take up an allocation though. If there is, Rangers should be hammered for it, but unless they can get them under a catch all disrepute charge, I can’t see any action being taken, other than a quiet word being had.

    • In exercising that right they will be taking other people’s money that other people would not want them to.

      A bit like tax avoidance really but as long as its in the rules its ok eh?

  22. You obviously do not have a clue what the rule means, have a nice day.

  23. mick

    alex your getting a bit much and are attacking people at will now piss of some were else

  24. Johnboy

    I am grateful to you for what you have written above. I like to think that I have a reasonable balance about what I write. You have been very gracious. If only I could bring you and Cam closer together.

    I think it is important that on this blog we bend over backwards to try to see each other’s viewpoint and we should do it with as much dignity as we can muster. We need to read what people say and try as much as possible not to read too deeply into what writers motives might be. We should correct, but we should not assume bias where none exists. A number of posters on this site are RFC supporters and they declare it, but the mere fact that they are willing to debate is to their credit. We may not agree, but that does not mean we should be disagreeable. I happen to find much of what the RFC posters say to be interesting and I feel it is for all of us to play nice. As Maggie suggests a group hug all round. Also, I would like this site to be a place where fair minded people can debate robustly. We can all see bigotry and hatred and we should all meet it with reason and soundly based discussion.

    I have given copies of this and your posts to my son and he is relieved, especially so as I now allow him out of the back pantry for an hour or so. I can assure you and others here that I will be with those of the green persuasion tomorrow night.

  25. lordmac

    there is only one rule open to the sfa that they can use, without a court case and it is on the grounds that the member club and chairman have stated they will not take tickets leaves him wide open and his club nothing to do with the support for what they do, even if they did take tickets next week it has gone passed that the SFA would be within there right to remove them from the competition on the grounds that the member club is not participating in the competition so they can be sine died or the old way of doing things like place the black ball into the box and wait and see it come out the other end , for members that bring the game into disrepute there aint a court in Scotland able to save them yes all can say we are not buying tickets that is not the problem. to abide buy the SFA rules you have to follow there instruction as part of the licence they issue

    • ecojon

      @ lordmac

      Seems fair to me: Award the game to Dundee Utd – fine Rangers an amount equal to the gate money that Utd would have got if the game was played and give it to Utd – ban Rangers from competition next year.

      It’ll keep their fans happy anyway as they’re now saying they should be boycotting the Scottish Cup for 10-15 years and leave it to the diddy teams

      That should catch the attention of any would-be institutional investors 🙂

      • Marching on Together


        i would agree with you if there is a rule that Rangers have broken in doing what they have done. I don’t have time at the moment to go through the rule-book to analyse it, but hopefully that will be the subject of Paul’s next post.

        However, if no rule has actually been broken (and my feeling that the only rule is the disrepute rule), then that should be the end of it, other than a rule being introduced to stop it happening again. Surely the lesson of the past 10 months is that the rules should be applied fairly and impartially to all, and not action taken, and the rules bent based on some desire to punish.

      • Marching on Together

        “they’re now saying they should be boycotting the Scottish Cup for 10-15 years and leave it to the diddy teams”

        I thought Rangers now was a diddy team? I have a mate who is a Ross County supporter, and he is quite proud of the fact that his big team is now Ross County and his diddy team is Rangers.

    • Felpan

      Couple of points on this statement,
      This is a unanimous decision by the board, senior management and staff at Ibrox. But that could not be true because Ally was so looking forward to this game! http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/football-mccoist-looking-forward-united-test-180943431.html

      On another point and I suppose this is a perfect fitting to this guest blog is a line in Mr Greens statement..
      ”It is unsurprising too that there has been a reaction from our supporters to this particular fixture.
      “The last thing we as a club want to do is to compromise security arrangements for any match”
      The fact that The Rangers chairman openly admits the ”The Rangers fans” could turn on each other and ”compromise security arrangements for any match” tells it all really of where we are on Rangers now Rangers then and Rangers wherever!

      • lordmac

        what old charlie is now trying to say is he supports the SFA but wants it known he is supporting the fans and fears for there safty that way he is every ones pal.

      • Adam

        Very poor attempt. You should write the next sentence to put it in real context. What he said was:

        “The last thing we as a club want to do is to compromise security arrangements for any match. I therefore appeal to all fans not to travel to this match and to Dundee United not to sell tickets to Rangers supporters.”

        That’s a completely different sentiment to the one you tried to push out.

        • Felpan

          @ Adam

          So that makes it better does it? Have I missed something! Have Dundee United supporters come out and said they will attack any The Rangers supporters if they see them going to the game? I did however hear that the The Rangers supporters were going to be Picketing outside the game, So who was it Charlie and the bhoys were referring to when he said

          “The last thing we as a club want to do is to compromise security arrangements for any match. I therefore appeal to all fans not to travel to this match and to Dundee United not to sell tickets to Rangers supporters.”

          • Adam

            Charles Green was saying re security of selling tickets to Rangers fans in the wrong end of the ground. Perfectly sensible thing to do for anyone with a quarter of a brain.

            As for picketting, ive read elsewhere it was one idiot that suggested it and it got shot down…….but hey say anything enough and it goes down in folklore.

            Just need to read the Marco Negri interview to see that….dont you ?

  26. ecojon



    We believe that the stance taken by Rangers brings them into disrepute in respect of the Scottish Cup. We therefore call on the SFA to act strongly, in particular by stating that the normal competition rules in respect of an equal split of gate money do not apply in this case and that all revenues should be retained by Dundee United.

  27. Charlie is only following orders from the O. sLudge. They have briefed him on what to say before he rides off into the sunset with all his booty. . .which by my reckoning will be pretty soon. Stirr up the SFA and the SPL and make a mockery of the whole of Scottish football before you go as revenge for what they have done to us. They won’t sack you because you now know too much. Just say what you like as long as it benefits our club. Call them all bigots! Call them all thieves! Wear the Orange Top and the rabble-rousing hordes will sell their hoose for the club. Yer going anyway Charlie may as well go out in a blaze of GLORY and be loved by the poor deluded fools into the bargain. We have now got the Cardigan back and that will allow the poor fools to think that nothing has changed! Result. . .their money will son be our money. . .yeeeee haaaa!!!!!

    It may not be word for word but i don’t think it is far from the truth.

    The whole of Scottish football should now boycott this toxic little club until the SFA throw the book at them or kick them out once and for all.

    • lordmac

      yes that is the exact plan, creat the smoke get about 20 million if you can pay of yer lenders, keep about 6 million to yer self and boo hoo yer gone.

  28. mcfc


    Very interesting post – as an English outside I’ve been slowly piecing together the sectarian language and history. You’ve filled in some big gaps.
    Haven’t had time yet to read all the comments but suspect there will be corrections from other points of view – more the better to help me understand – thanks for taking the time – on behalf of the wider audience that this excellent blog seems to be attracting in recent weeks

  29. JohnBhoy

    Here is one to chew over in terms of is the team playing at Ibrox the same as the team that played there before liquidation. The info provided to AIM today stated amongst other things.

    ” Rangers International Football Club plc following admission
    will own and operate Rangers Football Club Limited. Rangers
    Football Club, based in Scotland, has become one of the world’s
    most successful clubs, having won 54 League titles, 33 Scottish
    Cups, 27 League Cups and the European Cup Winners’ Cup in 1972.
    PLAYING at the 50,987 seater Ibrox Stadium, Scotland, and BENEFITTING
    from the world class 37 acre Murray Park training facility,
    the club has been a dominant force in Scottish football for
    The club generates revenues from match-day sales, broadcasting
    rights, retail and merchandising as well as other media rights.”

    the words in caps were spotted by a KDS hawkeye who commented why not “owners of”in both cases?

    So if the team playing there are not the owners as the liquidated Rangers were, are they actually new tenants moved in to an “empty” if paying rent to whoever the owners are, or maybe even, perish the thought, squatters?

    There are of course other questions about who owns what and who or what a share is actually a share in, but that is for another day.

  30. AyrshireScot

    Just a quick point on UEFA.It was the oldco that held the licence not the actual club and with the club transferring to a newco that’s what causes the break in membership.

    This is not a break in clubs history,in fact Rangers under the newco has been awarded a 0.5800 co-efficient by UEFA this season because of the results of Rangers games last season under the oldco.UEFA does not and would not award points that belong to one club and give them to another.
    Though because of the not too good euro results last season,Rangers have now dropped to 84th in the top 100 clubs.

  31. You lot really are tremendous, on the website of a failed lawyer., sorry disgraced lawyer who should be nowhere near a CAB,, debating on the morals of our history…

    Did you lot ever apologise for failing in your duty of care to those kids torbett abused?

  32. in the words of your song it states if you know our history well someone check the out the facts
    celtic in there early years as an irish catholic team and in 1920s
    refused to sell player to rangers because the were not a catholic team
    owned by a catholic family .p.s that other song use sing soon there will be no protestants at all . tell a lie to your self and the celtic fans . but others
    will know the truth

  33. I advise you to remove this fucking blog rangers 1872 still exist and will never die the uda will find you paul

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