Charles Green “Over Next 7 Days, All the Questions will be Answered”. Here are Some for Sevco Rangers

Mr Green has promised answers to “all the questions” within seven days. I have suggested a few for him to respond to.

I also note he talks about what happens “if” the Appellate Tribunal re-convenes. I wonder of the SFA will announce soon what is happening with that. I am sure Lord Carloway has a summer holiday to go on!

It also seems to be the case, although this is not a surprise of course, that in Mr Green’s mind “the good of Scottish football” = the preservation of “Rangers”.

—————————————————–

Charles Green has made a couple of statements via Pravda, aka the official Rangers website.

The first deals with the unknown factors. It is titled “All Will Become Clear”.

Mr Green is quoted as follows, with my comments in bold beneath. I will add some thoughts on his second post in a later blog.

—————————————————–

“People who know me well say I talk too much but in reality the fans are angry here because I haven’t said enough. It’s because I haven’t answered all the questions but over the next seven days, all the questions will be answered.

This is an open invitation, is it not, for journalists to compile every relevant question they can think of for Mr Green?

Let’s have a quick run through of some that come to mind immediately.

1)      Who are his backers?

2)      What are his long-term and short-term plans?

3)      Why is Sevco Scotland Ltd not selling any season tickets this season by Direct Debit?

4)      Did all the major banks turn down Sevco Scotland Ltd as a customer?

5)      Does Sevco Scotland Ltd have an overdraft facility with its new bankers, Metro Bank?

6)      Is the investment by the backers in the form of loans to be repaid by the company or in the purchase of shares?

7)      Have all the “assets and business” of Rangers Football Club PLC been transferred from Sevco 5088 Ltd to Sevco Scotland Ltd?

8)      Do Mr Green and his backers have a contingency plan in the event that he does not have a football team playing anywhere next season?

9)      Can Sevco Scotland Ltd survive with no income from Scottish football next season, and will they become a “Harlem Globetrotter” team to bring in funds?

10)   Did Sevco acquire the rights to receive the balance of transfer fees formerly due to Rangers Football Club PLC, for example the sums due by Everton for Mr Jelavic?

11)   Did Sevco acquire the rights of Rangers Football Club PLC to pursue the damages claims against Mr Whyte, Rangers FC Group Ltd and Collyer Bristow?

12)   What price was agreed to be paid by Sevco for the fixed assets of Rangers Football Club PLC?

13)   Was Mr Green approached by Duff & Phelps, or did he approach them?

14)   When did Mr Green first have discussions with Duff & Phelps?

15)   What discussions has Mr Green had with the SPL, SFA and SFL since he became involved with the Ibrox team?

16)   Will Sevco need to sell players to remain solvent, in the event of its team being in the SPL, SPL2, SFL1, SFL3 or nowhere?

17)   Were the former Rangers players told that their contracts of employment were to be transferred under TUPE to Sevco 5088 Ltd, to Sevco Scotland Ltd or simply to “Sevco”?

18)   Were the players told who their new employer was to be at all?

19)   Does Mr Green know what it was that he said to John Brown that so upset him?

Feel free to add more in the comments, and we can compile a list, which we can send to Mr Green.

Charles Green shows his delight at having the chance to answer all of the outstanding questions!

 

“I will always understand why the fans are worried because of the Craig Whyte situation and issues before that with David Murray. That’s not going to disappear overnight. It is still frustrating, nevertheless, but there are times when we can’t say anything because it could prejudice what is being discussed and what is talked about behind the scenes. There’s far too much of Scottish football being played out in the media rather than being played out in the boardrooms.

It is ironic when Mr Green talks like this, complaining about things being played out in the open, rather than behind closed doors. Will he speak to Mr McCoist, that well-known advocate of “transparency and clarity” to tell him that his demands for such are inappropriate?

Is Mr Green upset that the various plans which have been floated to place his team in as high a League as possible have become known, have been dissected, and the customers have voiced their opinions?

 

“Having come through the pain Rangers fans have in the last four months, having to wait another seven or eight days isn’t too much to ask in my mind.”

Maybe the fans think it is!

 

The article continues:- Green has spent much of the last fortnight speaking to chairmen of other SPL clubs to outline why he feels Rangers should be kept among Scottish football’s elite and he feels people are now in a better position to make decisions with an enhanced understanding of the economic effects relegating the Light Blues would have.

Another question for Mr Green, as this is relevant to the fans of the various SPL teams – which SPL Chairmen have you met?

This will allow the fans to raise matters with their own clubs and Boards to check that what is being said publicly is no different from what might have “played out in the boardrooms”.

The “Light Blues” are not being “relegated”. The Light Blues are not a member of the SPL or indeed, by Sevco’s own admission, the SFA. They therefore are not in the SPL to find themselves relegated from there.

 

Green added: “I know the chairmen will listen. The problem some of them have to a lesser degree than I have here is fan pressure. I said to a number of them over the weekend that if they’re concerned about their fans, they should come to Ibrox for a week and sit in my chair.

By all accounts if Mr Green listened to his fans, he would sell out immediately to Walter Smith’s group, or to John Brown’s consortium, or to a fan co-operative immediately. The season ticket debacle, and the apparently tiny sales of season tickets before the Direct Debit scheme stopped, suggest that fan pressure is all going one way. Rangers fans do not want Mr Green.

The Man Who Would Be King (but not Dave). John Brown makes his move.

Perhaps fans of the Light Blues who read this blog can tell me if my understanding is wrong. Maybe the silent majority are right behind him?

 

“Fans are the lifeblood of all clubs and without them we have no product so we have to engage with them.

Another question for Mr Green – how far does engaging with the fans go, if it does not extend to doing what they want? The opinions from most SPL fans seems to be that if the Light Blues are to play anywhere net season, which is not certain, they should be in SFL3. Indeed the opinion of many Ibrox supporters seems to accord with that too. Why therefore the frantic efforts to “remain” in the SPL, or to rush through an SPL2, or to go directly to SFL1?

 

“A lot of the decisions that are going to be made in the next seven days are going to be made by other people. Rangers have clearly got some input into the decision-making process and the team and I are going to present to the SPL chairmen on Wednesday.

No Mr Green, all the decisions over the next seven days will be made by other people. Sevco Scotland Ltd has to await the decisions of various bodies, some of which I outlined yesterday.

Will Mr Green reveal his presentation to SPL Chairmen after the meeting, so that his fans and those of the other SPL teams can see what the SPL reject, or else, in a Damascene conversion, accept?

 

“We’ll put forward our case that we think needs looking at. We think the important thing is Scottish football and we need to draw a line and move forward.

Come on Mr Green. You think that important thing is Scottish football? Forgive my scepticism. If that is the case, and the SPL and SFA and SFL exclude your company from competition, “for the good of Scottish football”, then will you accept that? Or is it your position that “the good of Scottish football” is what is good for your company?

I can see why Mr Green wants to “draw a line”. However there are still many things to be resolved and clarified from the past as they still affect the present.

 

“There is now a clearer understanding of the implications of football without Rangers because remember, this is not just about Rangers not being in the SPL.

I wonder if Mr Green will share this “clearer understanding” with us? It does not seem, for example, to extend to Sky TV abandoning Scottish football if they do not have four so called “Old Firm” games to show each season, as this has been debunked by Sky itself.

 

“Lord Carloway may even just withdraw the licence to play at all if we go back to the tribunal.

Mr Green seems confused. Right now Sevco Scotland Ltd has no licence to play. That is why it has applied for SFA membership. The Appellate Tribunal under Lord Carloway cannot withdraw a licence that does not exist. If Mr Green wishes Sevco Rangers to be dealt with as a continuation of Rangers Football Club PLC, then that is another matter. His reference to “if we go back to the Tribunal” is concerning. Has he received any background briefing from the SFA as to its intentions? Maybe he can tell us?

 

“There are some big decisions and none are more material than Rangers being excluded from the league and the financial incomes this club drives for the benefit of all Scottish clubs.”

According to Mr Green therefore the economic issue is paramount. Alleged cheating, sporting integrity and the worst form of bringing the game into disrepute short of match-fixing do not come into it?

The Ibrox team’s case about lost income in the sport is a smoke and mirrors job. People talk about the 40,000-50,000 fans that will be lost to Scottish football. However, these fans attend Ibrox every second week. Because of the financial structure of Scottish football, the only team to benefit from that is the home team. Rangers last season did not send 40,000 fans to away games. Especially with the TV coverage, it was common for the away stands not to be sold out when Rangers, or Celtic, were visitors. Does Scottish football die because many of the Ibrox faithful spend the “away” weekend in B&Q, rather than at Fir Park or Rugby Park?

Surely a revitalised Scottish Premier League, with all the teams having a greater chance of success, will lead to increased numbers of fans, both of home and away teams? It might not match the away support of Rangers last season, but how crippling will the shortfall be? There will be reduced policing and stewarding costs and I know many people, fans of different clubs, who would not take their families to their local ground when Rangers visited, but who would go to see other teams.

Scottish football did not die in the 1980’s when Rangers were at a low ebb and when Dundee United and Aberdeen were reaching European finals. That is a long time ago now, in football terms, but the league thrived then. Is the influence of the former Rangers so great that if it collapses in on itself, it will form a black hole sucking the rest of Scottish football into the abyss with it, never to escape?

A Black Hole, or the future of Scottish football without “Rangers”?

Ironically the team which could have most to lose financially from the demise of Rangers is Celtic. As the biggest recipient of TV funds, a drop in that income will have the greatest effect at Parkhead. Balanced against that is the possibility of more income from European football, but against the back cloth of a possibly lower co-efficient and therefore a harder road to the big money.

I think it is interesting that having mentioned the good of Scottish football as the main issue, Mr Green quickly conflates this with the money that Rangers “drive for the benefit of all Scottish clubs.”

I am not sure how much the teams in the SFL would be damaged by there being no Sevco team in the League, and indeed surely the SFL and its members would benefit most of Mr Green’s team started in SFL3 and tried to work its way up the divisions?

 

 

Posted by Paul McConville

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26 Comments

Filed under Celtic, Charles Green, Football, Football Governance, Rangers, SFA, SFL, SPL, TUPE

26 responses to “Charles Green “Over Next 7 Days, All the Questions will be Answered”. Here are Some for Sevco Rangers

  1. Lennybhoy

    Paul,

    I have a good friend who is placed within HMRC. On your question 13. He got excited when he heard Mr. Green say on T.V. after it became clear they (HMRC) would not agree CVA. He said that HMRC should have told “us” in March rather than waste our time. My friend has heard rumours linking Green and Whyte but did not give much credence to them. However, he got very animated when he heard Mr. Green on T.V., interesting question.

    • Lenny,

      It was that answer that piqued my interest too.

    • Al

      Interesting points. Since you’re a legal beagle I was wondering if you knew why the SFA have a rule about informing them of everything a club pays a player. Why is it significant or even relevant the authorities know what a club pays a player? For what reason was this rule introduced. A bit of background to the introduction of the rule might help people understand why it’s there and what it’s purpose is.

  2. michael burt

    The noose tightens on Whyte & Green

  3. josephmcgrath112001809

    Another seven days? How much clarity have achieved in the last seven months? Sounds like ‘Give us seven days to push stuff under the carpet’

  4. Great piece again Paul but the most important question to mr green is when are the builders moving in

  5. p groom

    green is a canny operator alright. insist threaten demand long and loud enough and he thinks he will get what he wants which is spl and nothing but the spl. anything less is financially not worth it for him . expect a veritable tsunami of abuse from him if by some miracle sfa/spl/sfl develop some cojones and allow sevco in to div 3 . at which point green will do us all a favour and sell up. and spare me all this pious ranting ” its all about the fans” .

  6. duggie73

    Did any Sevco investors invest in Ticketus at the time of the Whyte take-over?
    Is Green willing to legally bind himself not to carry out sale for leaseback of Ibrox and not to sell off Murray Park for development?

  7. Grab the grass

    The really key question which Mr Green needs to provide a clear, unambiguos answer is: Does he accept that if the “club” he and his fellow investors now own is “Rangers FC” and if they want to continue with that club name, history, club colours etc then as a quid pro quo he will accept full responsibility for their past sporting misdemanours / outstanding fines, any future punishment (AT, dual contracts etc)??

    If yes then everyone (SFA, SPL etc) can move forward with their investigations and panels in the knowledge that there is an ongoing entity with which to actually deal with.

    If no, then please tell what the new name of your club is going to be (without the word rangers anywhere in it) and clearly state it is a NEW football “club” which just happens to play at Ibrox, but which is now completely separate from the “club” which used to play there and therefore cannot accept and liabilites for that past club (sporting or commercial). Then a new start in whatever division the SFL decide can take place.

    There should be no obscufcation here – a clear yes or no. I could understand that they want to distance themselves from the PLC corporate debt issue, but as noted on an earlier blog by Paul, football works in a separate universe and the rules are clearly written around “clubs” and only occasionally about owners and therefore “clubs” can survive with differnet owners, but then need to be fully responsible for the past actions of the “club”. It is just as well that the SPL have made the distinction between club and owner otherwise there would be no vote for the SPL chairmen to make in two days time…

    • p groom

      no good just asking questions of green. of course he will say yes to anything. call his bluff about agreeing to settle all football debts ( no mention of creditors, tough) AFTER sevco is admitted. tell him to do it BEFORE and he will run a mile… no money to comply anyway.

  8. paul

    Traynor and the mysterious £16million
    I am not a journalist and do not have access to the powers that be in Scottish football so I may be missing something, but for anyone to suggest that ‘Scottish football’ will lose out on £16million next season without rangers is beyond belief!
    I do however have access to ‘google’ and in one hour this morning have ascertained the following information.
    Let’s look at some figures:
    Ticket sales-
    Let’s say ‘RFC’ took 4000 fans to every away game in the SPL, I calculate that to be about £80,000 per match of which there could be 19, therefore £1,520,000 in sales plus some pies etc, let’s say a total of £2,000,000, of which the profit if we are kind could be £1,000,000 in total, for the season. There are policing, security and staff costs, plus the actual pies have to be bought in. There are also repairs and cleaning to be accounted for. Still a 50% margin would be quite impressive.
    Let’s add another £250,000 profit for corporate sales, (just a guess, but unlikely to be more) giving a total profit lost to the SPL of circa £1,250,000. (split between all clubs)
    The sky deal has two years to go and currently has no minimum 4 old firm fixtures clause, so no loss there. Uncertain as to what new deal could be cut after two years, but scaremongers suggesting there will be no deal are wide of the mark. Current deal was £65,000,000 for three seasons ending now, with an SPL only option to extend for two further years. There is no option for Sky or ESPN to cancel at this point. Another two years would produce income from TV at £43,333,333 until the summer of 2014.

    The SFL payment will remain the same, so no loss there. In fact RFC will bring extra income to the SFL through gate receipts and increased sponsorship deals etc.

    RFC will not claim the 2nd place prize money, so there is an add back of £1,950,000 for the second place. If each club ascends one place this season, then it would receive an extra £65,000 (total £585,000). In summary, one club will receive £770,000 extra in prize money with the other nine potentially getting an extra £65,000 each.

    With a loss of £1,250,000 being replaced with either £1,950,000 or £1,355,000 (£585,000 + £770,000), it appears to me that the SPL with be better off by the tune of £150,000 to £700,000 this year, without RFC.
    Celtic would be the only club to suffer financially from this situation as the OF games produce a lot of extra revenue streams.
    I have not accounted either for the fact that other teams will bring some visiting fans to away games generating revenue, or for the fact that an extra European place is available each season generating some revenue for specific clubs.
    I have exhausted all areas I can think of and have yet to find a missing £16,000,000 per season for the next two seasons, but maybe I am not as astute as Mr Traynor and his fellow ‘journalists’ who will obviously be able to point out how stupid I am and the obvious sums I have missed. I am sure he will be able to produce his complex workings as to where the £16,000,000 is, and at this point I will humbly bow down to his superior intellect and start buying his ‘newspaper’ again. If not I will treat his internet bampot comments with the disgust they deserve.

    I am sure there will be recognition of sponsorship deals. I do agree that they are likely to fall if RFC do not appear to be arriving in SPL imminently, but these deals are normally three to five years long and cannot be instantly dismissed today as worth £0,000,000 (nothing)
    I would point out before others do, that this is only a two years into the future view, and that longer term, income streams will fall if RFC do not return to SPL, but I feel that two years is plenty of time for clubs to get their houses in order and become more sustainable, albeit at a lower level.
    Please send this out to the world, by email, blog, twitter and all other means, as the public deserve to see the facts and then judge for themselves how to vote.
    Paul, Scottish football supporter.

    • James Tweedie

      Traynor’s a discredited buffoon and his opinions only carry weight now with knuckle-dragging morons of a certain persuasion who are reassured and comforted by his fairytales. For others he has become a comedy “author” par excellence (in actuality, he has been for several years now) as he cuts an ever more ridiculous figure. Not worth reading or listening to, apart from the comedy value of course.

  9. degough

    The first question should be
    How much money has each investor given you so far and how much have they committed to give you in the future?
    “Follow the money”

  10. cmh64

    Malcolm Murray has made a statement apologising on behalf of Rangers. Has he any authority to do this? He’s not Chairman of Rangers is he? How much are Sevco (whichever version) allowed to use the name and associated symbols of Rangers before the liquidation happens? Is this just smoke and mirrors or is it an acceptance that ‘newclub’ are in fact ‘oldclub’? I’d have thought any apology should come from people associated with ‘oldclub’ for it to mean something.
    There seems to bit of ‘if we call it Rangers often enough, people will believe it is Rangers’ going on here.

  11. JimBhoy

    I think the 16 mill may be what oldco rangers may have taken in season book/ ticket money so totally irrelevant. Like Celtic they would have a large travelling suport so the local economy would get a boost for sure, no argument there. Would that be the same in Div 3 who knows. Paul had a good point and my killie mate concurs, he would not go near his home ground if Rangers were playing, just too much hassle. I think we would see an upturn in ticket sales for this fact generally and because of the chance of more success as one of the big two are not around.. Success would breed more of this on an ongoing basis. All teams would give more chance to homegrown youngsters. Rememeber we lost all TV revenue for a season when Setanta went tits up.. We took Setanta cos they offered more than BSkyB at the time, when BSkyB came back after the Setanta collapse they could offer us less than they had done previously… This was the then greed mentality we need to avoid.. Around that time Hibs ramped up their youth development and we saw some v good players come thru….

  12. mick

    things are going well most div1 saying no ,dont read msm traynor and co are fighting for there lives there a joke save a tree dont buy the daily record its full of lies ,hail hail

  13. Manwitwoheids

    I think the prime question should be, “Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?”

  14. There's Only One Willie Miller

    The obvious question to ask Green is ‘do you have any connection to Craig Whyte or even Craig White?’

  15. Mik

    Great questions Paul, cant really see Traynor and the rest if the BBC lackies asking them, and the fans wont ask because they are afraid of the answrers

  16. TheBlackKnight TBK

    20) how many of the backers are/ were involved with Ticketus?

  17. Tom

    Charles Green and Mike McDonald….. Green was CEO and McDonald was Chairman of Sheffield United they go back years and are very good friends….. G51 Ibrox project ( redeveloping the Ibrox Park area ) put on hold until money becomes available… McDonald’s company Silverbank Development Co Ltd , were the preferred company to re generate the area ( won the right to be the main contractors ) …. This was around yr 2008… Fast track to Craig Whyte he was involved with Ellis another property developer.. Whyte mentioned he was going to reserect the project.. But Ellis and Whyte fell out….Now Green is on the scene with McDonald…. Greens was director of a building developer company until recently ….. It’s to unreasonable the way Green never spoke to the players or asked Ally McCoist to speak to the players in 7 weeks to make sure they were on board with the NEWCO and offering incentives for them to stay with Rangers…The other thing is Green has been asking Walter Smith to get on board with his backers,, now he’s trying to take season ticket money from past ticket holders under another company name…..Green has no real backers the names of backers he gave to the papers are small time. If it can be substantiated that they have invested and how much money each has available to basically purchase at least 7 players at 1 million on avg per player plus the running costs of the Rangers I think we’ll all see they don’t have the cash to invest in Rangers up to £50 million.. So what’s next . The new hospital being constructed near Ibrox is the answer … New properties like Housing . Hotels. Shops are required in the area for the 2 thousand people is the estimated … counting the families of the Doctors, Nurses etc …..I believe Ibrox is finished…just remember Duff and Phelps at first were touting Rangers as a development opportunity. It was later they changed to finding a buyer for a going concern…Rangers FC.. Rangers at Ibrox as we know it is finished ,, I believe Hampden Park is the new home of Rangers….I enclose a statement from McDonald….Daily Express this year… If you read it carefully he is talking very like Whyte did before and just after he took over Rangers FC … all fans should be very careful where the put their Season Ticket Money

    ……………………………………………………………… McDonald worked alongside Green at Brammell Lane and is described by the Daily Express as one of his backers although Green is reluctant to reveal the identity of any of his business partners.
    Speaking to the Express McDonald said: “It is pointless to get involved if we weren’t going to invest in the playing side right away.
    “We see that as a major priority, although, obviously, that is dependent on the Scottish Football Association’s transfer embargo. We know that Ally McCoist needs to strengthen his team and also to keep some of the players he already has at the club.
    “We have got all our funding together for every aspect of the take over and now it is just a case of sorting it out. Charles has had a good conversation with Ally McCoist and we want him to carry on managing the team.
    “Charles has brought significant funds to the table because we know we need hundreds of millions to be successful at this level. There are a lot of people who are in this game for the publicity and think they can run a football club on a shoestring but it just isn’t possible, I know that.

  18. Pingback: The Sevco Board Met The Rangers Fans Fighting Fund – What Happened? | Random Thoughts Re Scots Law by Paul McConville

  19. Pingback: Seven Days Have Passed – Mr Green’s Promised Answers Re Sevco Seem to have Gone Missing | Random Thoughts Re Scots Law by Paul McConville

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